I need a volunteer

[Fidel_Castronaut]

But Esq, he is special...just not in the way he thinks.

[Angrboda]

You keep saying that we follow the wrong practice. You say that 40 years of Yoga has led you to where you know differently about consciousness and life. You've never been very specific about what your practice entails. If we're to follow your method, you'll at least have to tell us what it is. What does your practice look like. Do you do traditional meditation? How long and how often? Tantric meditation? What does 'Tantric meditation' as you practice it entail? You've suggested we practice intuitional science, well what activities does one perform to do that? What does your average days as a Tantra practicing 'intuitional science' look like? What intuitional science activities do you engage in during a typical week? Who did you learn these practices from? How much did you learn from Sarkar personally, as your Yogi, and how much came from other sources? What other sources did you learn from? How much time did you spend learning it, and how? If I want to learn this, what concrete steps do I need to take, and why are they important? Why will they lead me to union with the infinite?

You've babbled on for thread after thread, page after page, and have utterly failed to even give us a glimpse of tantra or intuitional science. If it is your intent to lead us to yoga and union with the infinite, you've been doing a piss poor job of it. What exactly is your intent here? Do you want us to learn intuitional science, or are you just jerking off to your own reflection.

Why should i explain you about intuitional science when you are not interested in? ... Your teacher will find you.

I am a Yogini, darling. I am a master. As such, I'm fully capable of assessing the merits of your practice. That you simply dismiss a Yogini when asked about your practice, and with such pathetic excuses, this suggests to me that you are not ready. I'm somewhat agnostic about reincarnation, though I expect to live again. Your senseless prattle, meaningless analogies, evasive double talk — as well as your inadvertent insolence in the face of a Yogini — does not encourage me to suspect that you are someone with spiritual accomplishments or virtue.

Tell me about your practice or I'll simply have to conclude that you are a poser and a charlatan, claiming fruits that are way beyond your reach.

I achieved union with the Shakti at the age of 4 without a teacher. Your prattling on, pretending to be enlightened, it's just sad and pathetic.

And I know better.

"In the Hindu tradition, mother is first guru (teacher) and in the Yoga tradition,
proper respect of Yoginis is a necessary part of the path to liberation."
~ Wikipedia

[Cyberman]

I got bad news for you Stimbo.

I snipped the rest, as this was the only coherent bit.

In all honesty, Ricky, I don't give a shit about your opinions. I was talking to the grownups. If I managed to yank your chain at the same time, that's merely a bonus.

[Little Rik]

Nice how you ignored me enrico, but not unexpected.

As far as you keep on being rude i have no choice but ignore you.
When instead you talk in a polite manner i always reply providing i have enough time.

I'm going to focus on NDE's in the hope that you might address this post.
NDE's are not evidence of anything. Firstly because they are anecdotes, science does not accept anecdotes as evidence for a very good reason. How do you know the person telling the anecdote is not lying? Deluded? Or just mistaken.

One person may be dreaming.
Hundreds of them may also be dreaming but when you got thousand of them saying the same or similar thing then you got to take it seriously.
Why would they ALL experience God and not Santa?

This isn't a rhetorical question, I want an answer to those questions from you. Please comply, it would be interesting.
And another reason why NDE's are not evidence: Even if annecdotes such as these were accepted as evidence in science, they would not be valid. Near death experiences are not 'death experiences'. Show me a person who has been dead for a week, every cell in their body has died and they come back somehow. Got someone like that? No. In every near death experience the person has not actually died, their brain may have stopped functioning temporarily but it is capable of being restarted which means they are not dead.
These points have been raised before, but just like before, I predict you are either going to ignore them or babble incoherently until the subject is changed as to avoid answering.

If you think that i may .............babble incoherently.........then why you ask?
1) You ask...............Show me a person who has been dead for a week, every cell in their body has died and they come back somehow............this mean absolutely nothing.
As far as a doctor say that this person is dead all the rest is not important whether has been dead one hour or one day or one month.
Again you guys IGNORE my point which is that several of these NDE's could see things that were in a place which they never being before or saw something that happen during their NDE and these experiences were witnessed and those who witness are still there to report the facts so you guys must either think that these witness are bogus or don't want to believe as this would make you admit that you lost the case.

[Esquilax]

One person may be dreaming.
Hundreds of them may also be dreaming but when you got thousand of them saying the same or similar thing then you got to take it seriously.
Why would they ALL experience God and not Santa?

They don't experience the same god, though. In fact, a lot of the time they experience mutually exclusive god variants, just excluding NDEs. Do you give credence to every single experience that thousands of people claim to share, even in situations where one group of people claims something that logically excludes something another group claims, or are you just giving special preference to the things you want to believe?

[Little Rik]

I am a Yogini, darling. I am a master. As such, I'm fully capable of assessing the merits of your practice.

It is quite obvious that you are not a master nor any reputable yogini.
Anyone who is serious about yoga would never ever boost what you are.

That you simply dismiss a Yogini when asked about your practice, and with such pathetic excuses, this suggests to me that you are not ready.

More garbage.
Anyone serious about yoga would know that only a qualify teacher can teach intuitional science as the mantra is different person to person so you would know that me as a non teacher could not tell about my personal mantra.

I'm somewhat agnostic about reincarnation, though I expect to live again. Your senseless prattle, meaningless analogies, evasive double talk — as well as your inadvertent insolence in the face of a Yogini — does not encourage me to suspect that you are someone with spiritual accomplishments or virtue.

More garbage.
Any serious yogi would know that reincarnation is there as to reach the very top one need more then one life.

Tell me about your practice or I'll simply have to conclude that you are a poser and a charlatan, claiming fruits that are way beyond your reach.

My relationship with the cosmic consciousness is mine and mine alone.
If you want to know how the system works you got to have desire and then start from the beginning.
As far as you ignore these facts you show that you know nothing about yoga.

I achieved union with the Shakti at the age of 4 without a teacher. Your prattling on, pretending to be enlightened, it's just sad and pathetic.

Please stop talking rubbish.
Wake up and grow up.

---

One person may be dreaming.
Hundreds of them may also be dreaming but when you got thousand of them saying the same or similar thing then you got to take it seriously.
Why would they ALL experience God and not Santa?

They don't experience the same god, though. In fact, a lot of the time they experience mutually exclusive god variants, just excluding NDEs. Do you give credence to every single experience that thousands of people claim to share, even in situations where one group of people claims something that logically excludes something another group claims, or are you just giving special preference to the things you want to believe?

Once in your life you raise an interesting point.
Unfortunately at the same time you show your lack of memory as in the past i already talk about it.
The thing is that we are all different so we experience things according to our level of consciousness and moreover God give us the experience that is more suitable for us in order to progress.
So if someone is already close to God he would experience more of the real thing, on the other hand if someone is not so close would experience less of the good thing as to experience big one require knowledge and feeling for the great.
In other words all is relative to our progress.

[Bad Wolf]

As far as you keep on being rude i have no choice but ignore you.
When instead you talk in a polite manner i always reply providing i have enough time.

Oh how convenient! You aren't going to answer me because you are choosing not to.....right. It appears as if you, in fact, don't have an answer.

One person may be dreaming.
Hundreds of them may also be dreaming but when you got thousand of them saying the same or similar thing then you got to take it seriously.
Why would they ALL experience God and not Santa?

None of them are dreaming. Dreaming is what happens when someone is asleep and goes into REM sleep. People who experience near death experiences do not dream, it is closer to a hallucination or delerium. A sudden release of chemicals in the brain.
And you are right when you say thousands of them are seeing similar things such as your god. But those are people who have been brought up christian. I wonder if any Hindus have seen god? Or Buddists? Or how about one of those tribes in the Amazon Rainforest? The answer is no. The similarities with NDE's can be explained purley by culture.
To answer your question, they experience god instead of santa because they actually believe god exists.

If you think that i may .............babble incoherently.........then why you ask?
1) You ask...............Show me a person who has been dead for a week, every cell in their body has died and they come back somehow............this mean absolutely nothing.

Erm.... no it doesn't

As far as a doctor say that this person is dead all the rest is not important whether has been dead one hour or one day or one month.

This......I don't even......
You really don't know what you are talking about, yet again. There is a huge difference between a person being dead an hour and a person being dead a month.
Under normal conditions a brain can only last about 3 minutes without oxygen, the organs and the rest of the tissues can survive a lot longer. Read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinical_death

Again you guys IGNORE my point which is that several of these NDE's could see things that were in a place which they never being before or saw something that happen during their NDE and these experiences were witnessed and those who witness are still there to report the facts so you guys must either think that these witness are bogus or don't want to believe as this would make you admit that you lost the case.

No we have not ignored it. We have dismissed it. We have told you why several times. Shall I do it again?
Once these 'special NDE's' are posted in a peer-reveiwed, scientific journal, only then will we consider them. But they aren't are they? They are in some stupid biased book that you read.

[Fidel_Castronaut]

Please stop talking rubbish.
Wake up and grow up.

Hey cunt boy, take your own goddamn advice once in a while eh?

[Angrboda]

Anyone who is serious about yoga would never ever boost what you are.

Ah yes, Lao Tzu and Siddhartha speak similarly. As a yogini it is my prerogative to disagree or make exception — that's what a Yogi does, idiot: She Leads, she does not follow the simplistic truisms of dullards like you.

Did Jesus not break the Sabbath? Are you claiming you are wiser than him?

Did Sarkar not reform the Hinduism of his day? Are you claiming you are wiser than him?

I didn't "boast." I was attempting to teach you. But instead of looking at the moon, you look at my finger and exclaim, "How rude! She's pointing! With her finger!"



You're so pathetically cliche that you're the punchline to a joke in a movie.

I am a Yogini, darling. I am a master. As such, I'm fully capable of assessing the merits of your practice.

It is quite obvious that you are not a master nor any reputable yogini.

"It's obvious" is the song of those who do not know. If it's "obvious," then point out the signs so that others may see.

Oh, so it has to be a special kind of yogini, a reputable one, not just a yogini. Just like when you were called on not being the only yoga practitioner, suddenly it had to be a specific type of yoga, so that you could say I didn't qualify. Moving them goalposts. Always changing your argument when it's shown wrong. The infinite is stable and solid. You are a mound of Jello. You do not know the infinite. I rather suspect you fancy yourself an Acharya. The only thing you teach people is how foolish some Hindus are. I actually enjoy watching you because you're so pathetically bad at this that it's laughable.

Oh, and I am far from reputable as a yogini, but I am quite reputable. You can verify that for yourself by looking in my profile.

As to the rest, Siddhartha Gautama Buddha was agnostic about the afterlife as well, yet if you tell me that he was not a master and that you are, you'll hear more laughter.




"I am the thread that runs through all these pearls" ~ Vivekananda

Reading through the quotes of the Swami, I'm struck by how you are but a pale, absurd echo of him and his words. I think Vivekananda was something of a twat, but he was a great man. You, you're just a fool.

Vivekananda quotes for comparison


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_84-A3LT0Lo

---

Again you guys IGNORE my point which is that several of these NDE's could see things that were in a place which they never being before or saw something that happen during their NDE and these experiences were witnessed and those who witness are still there to report the facts so you guys must either think that these witness are bogus or don't want to believe as this would make you admit that you lost the case.

Please cite the specific case or page number in a book. You're saying there are such cases does not mean they are what you say they are.

Present these specific cases, or I will simply deny your claim that they exist. You deny that I am a yogini on even flimsier grounds of my not showing sufficient humility (as if you are the judge of that). Don't be a hypocrite. I'll show you mine if you show me yours. I am a Hindu, just like you. The only difference is, people take me seriously. You, they laugh at and scorn.

Present your strongest NDE cases so we may examine them or fuck off.

---

Maybe I'm just not communicating in your own language? Would it help make my points more valid if I included some of these in every post?










hock:

---

hock: hock:

---

[Nightangel8212]

*Reads through the OP*
*Blinks slowly and tilts head to the side*
*Goes through the rest of the thread*

Ya know, before fstdt lost its forums, we had a guy who had been quoted on the main page come to the site to debate us. He had claimed to have battled Leviathan in his bathtub (no, I'm not joking). He claimed he could perform exorcisms through forums and several people volunteered. Of course, it was all bullshit, but he kept acting as if he'd proven something great to us, that he had exorcised a demon from one of the volunteers, even though the volunteer had stated flat out that absolutely nothing had happened.

In a way, this reminds me of that thread... except this one is much shorter... thankfully. I don't think my brain could handle reading enrico's posts for several hundred pages. As it is, I think I lost a huge chunk of my IQ. I was reminded of when the Nostalgia Critic reviewed the Digimon movie and his brain fell out of his ear with the opening theme song. It seriously felt like that to me.

Let me make a few things clear. I am a Solitary Witch who believes in life after death, multiple deities, and even nature spirits. I have had my own personal experiences that have cemented my personal faith. But I'm not one to disregard physical evidence and science out of hand. And I am also willing to acknowledge that I have absolutely NO EVIDENCE for my beliefs being right, only my personal experiences. Personal experiences don't mean fuck all in science, which is why NDE/OBE accounts are NOT considered valid evidence of life after death to science.

I'm not going to bother quoting Enrico since he pretty much repeated himself a zillion times already, and my headache doesn't want to go back through the thread and read through his piles of dog excrement to find the specific quote, but he said something along the lines of "Prove to me that life is finite." (And there went two more IQ points just typing out that sentence)

Now... this is the stupidest fucking thing I've ever heard. Even Mister I-Battled-Leviathan-In-My-Bathtub would say what the fuck to something like that! Physical death is 100% proven. I watched my grandmother die of cancer. My mother was at death's door a few years back. She was so close to death my father called in a Catholic Priest to give her her last rites. She managed to pull through the night, and the experimental treatments the doctors were using on her (thankfully) worked. (oops, did I just disprove his assertion that medical science doesn't lead to progress? I'd say pulling my mother from the BRINK OF DEATH FUCKING QUALIFIES!!) When my mother woke up, she didn't even believe that a month had gone by. She thought she'd just gone to sleep for the night and remembered absolutely nothing. Does this mean there most definitely is NOT life after death? Not in my book. After all, she was pumped full of so many different drugs, it could have made her unable to remember any NDE she might have had.

I did have more in mind to say, but fuck it. Arguing with a fundy is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what moves you make, the pigeon will just knock over the pieces, shit on the board, and strut around like it's victorious.