(January 16, 2014 at 1:47 pm)Tea Earl Grey Hot Wrote: When theists say that God exists independently of the material world, are they saying he's an abstract thing like numbers, words, formulas, concepts, etc? I get this impression when they use presuppositional apologetics. Perhaps I'm wrong. I'm willing to admit that in this case. But if they are saying God is an abstract thing, then I could make this argument:
If something is abstract, then it does not exist apart from the human mind.
God is abstract.
Therefore, God does not exist apart from the human mind.
No?
I think you may be confusing 'abstract' and 'transcendent'. The latter, which is a proper philosophical term, is not to be confused with transcendental meditation and similar; it means 'not part of our physical universe'.
The Christian POV is that God is transcendent, but is also immanent- 'active within the physical universe'. This has been achieved in a variety of mechanisms, with Jesus and the Holy Spirit being two relevant examples. They represent the presence of the immanent God in our physical universe.
Xians should not be thinking in terms of God being abstract, because that would be open to the sort of ontological problems you outline in the OP. Direct them to John 1 for how the above plays out.
