500

[DeistPaladin]

Lately, I've been hearing a lot from visiting Christians that 500 witnesses saw Jesus ascend into the sky after his resurrection.

The reference is to Paul's testimony in 1Cor 15. First, let me begin by going step by step through the relevant parts of the chapter:

1COR 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

What scriptures? The Gospels had not yet been written. And why did he need to hear about it from the scriptures instead of an obvious recent history, one that happened only a few years prior?

And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

Actually, he died on Friday and rose before dawn on Sunday according to John, so that seems more like two days, but hey, who's counting?

15:5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:

But Cephas (Peter) WAS one of the disciples and Judas was dead and Mattias, his replacement, hadn't yet been chosen.

15:6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.

If 500 people saw him at once, how did they not convert? According to Acts, the Christians numbered at 120.

15:7 After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.

Wasn't James one of the 12?

15:8 And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.

But all this happened within Paul's lifetime. How was Paul born at the wrong time? Did Paul believe the resurrection of Jesus happened in a distant past? Would that explain why he heard about it "from the scriptures" instead of recent memory?

Now on to Acts

Acts 1:1-3 The former treatise have I made, O Theophilus, of all that Jesus began both to do and teach,
Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:
To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God:

So Jesus hung around for 40 days after the resurrection? Not exactly consistent with the Gospel accounts, some of which say he rose into Heaven that very day. Ironically, the Gospel of Luke, supposedly the same author as Acts of the Apostles, is one of the sources that says "same day".

1:9-11 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

So this marks the ascension.

1:15 And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,)

So there were only 120 of them. Why not 500? Did the other 380 just say, "Meh, just some guy flying up into the clouds. And those angels saying something or other, happens all the time".

500 isn't 120.

[Fidel_Castronaut]

Not that I need to say anything further than you've written, DP, but needless to say,the bible is simply the claim and not the evidence. Anyone claiming otherwise can be dismissed quite easily.

[Minimalist]

Clearly D-P you are not reading it in the proper context.

That context would be that you have to be an ignorant sod who unflinchingly accepts every piece of shit he is told.

[Tonus]

That's the beauty of it, it's just ambiguous enough to allow for all kinds of interpretations. And if it's not ambiguous enough, just mix in a few measures of allegory, analogy, and/or metaphor until it is.

[FreeTony]

At least 2-3 million Americans claim to have been abducted by Aliens. These are people you can go and actually talk to.

[truthBtold]

Cretards... in 3..2..1....

[Mudhammam]

I take "according to the Scriptures" to refer to the Old Testament and Matthew's Gospel confirms this as well: the belief in a dying and rising God had nothIng to do with the "appearances"; it had everything to do with their interpretation of the Old Testament and reading Jesus into their Hellenistic brand of Judaism.

[DeistPaladin]

I take "according to the Scriptures" to refer to the Old Testament and Matthew's Gospel confirms this as well: the belief in a dying and rising God had nothIng to do with the "appearances"; it had everything to do with their interpretation of the Old Testament and reading Jesus into their Hellenistic brand of Judaism.

If so, it would dovetail nicely with my speculations that Paul was writing about a Jesus who existed in a distant past.

[max-greece]

Deist,

I do so admire you for continuing to read the NT. I have given up on it as the last time I did it depressed me hugely.

All I could think of as I worked my way methodically through Mark's gospel was - and people believe in this? Two point something billion people believe in this?

I pretty much lost all hope for humanity for a long while after that. I don't think I am strong enough to attempt to go anywhere near it again.

[Mudhammam]

I posted the OP question on my Facebook and here's what one of my Christian friends replied with:

"Just because he appeared to five hundred people does not mean they would have all been in that room on that particular occasion. Its pretty difficult to get 500 specific people with different schedules in the same room even today and we have cell phones and text messaging."

If anyone feels like schooling a gullible Christian, my Facebook is Sean R. Strnad. I'd welcome any comments (all I ask is that you play nice. This kid is dense but I still may run into him in person)