Homosexuals "wrecking" Christian careers

[DeistPaladin]

Go for it.

In a free market those employees will find other jobs. You will have put yourself at a competitive disadvantage. You might even go out of business.

Ah, I see. You seem to be one of those who thinks that market forces solves all social ills. I can understand because I used to think the same way. How old are you? 16? 18? You'll learn when you get out in the real world.

Market forces didn't end segregation. That took government intervention.
Market forces didn't fight sexual harassment in the workplace. That requires government litigation.
Market forces didn't change "buyer beware" or establish consumer protection. That required government regulation.
...as does worker safety...
...as does environmental protection...
...as does the maintenance of infrastructure...
...and so on...

Operating a business in the public domain requires operating it in a responsible and non-discriminatory manner. That's not "slavery".

You know what is slavery?

Slavery.

That's where you don't get paid for your services. That's where don't work in a safe environment. That's where your master gets to regularly rape your wife and your sons and daughters are sold down the river and you never see them again. That's where you get terrorized, beaten and threatened with death if your services don't satisfy. So knock off the hyperbole that boo hoo, you can't keep the fags out of your bakery. Don't make light of our nation's second greatest shame, second only to the massive genocide of the native population, by claiming that the government stopping you from cramming your beliefs down the throats of others is somehow comparable.

And you'll thank us when Christianity does become the minority to "no religion" and it will remain illegal for an atheist majority to discriminate against you for your goofy beliefs.

[FlyingNarwhal]

I just wanna play devil's advocate here for a moment, because I am curious, so I'll ask a couple of questions. As we are talking about whether or not a business should be legally allowed to discriminate against its customers, it seems like the general consensus from mostly everyone here is that a business should not be allowed to do that (an example being the Christian photographer not wanting to take pictures of a gay wedding). I'm curious if this works the other way around for a lot of you. Should a gay baker be forced to make a cake that says "God hates fags" on it if his customer chooses so for her anti gay rally? Or a black photographer forced to photograph the wedding of a Grand Dragon's daughter?

[sven]

Oh man... That's almost all I can say, really. Oh man.
I wish all gay people in the world could move to my country, where society has actually progressed out of the last century... Scratch that; the century before that.

[Fidel_Castronaut]

Which is such a good foundation in which to build a modern, free thinking, liberal and advanced society, isn't it?

:-|

It won't happen. Too many people want to impose their will on others.

Yeah, folk like you.

[Rampant.A.I.]

Totally. Millions of jobs shipped overseas for pennies on the dollar = government meddling.

In the same way that child labor and minimum wage laws = government meddling.

Minimum wage was implemented to keep the blacks poor and preserve jobs for the whites.....Billybob couldn't have some negro diluting his ability to earn a living wage he argued. But the whites shot themselves in the foot over the long run as most of those jobs did end up moving overseas to colored people.

Laws requiring paying people more per hour were invented to keep their income lower and the unchecked greed of large corporations moving jobs overseas to avoid regulations by the government is an act of a free market economy, which you seem to believe is a superior system.

The only "conspiracy" necessary is the tacit conspiracy of corporate greed, which is why corporations require government regulation.

[Heywood]

Ah, I see. You seem to be one of those who thinks that market forces solves all social ills. I can understand because I used to think the same way. How old are you? 16? 18? You'll learn when you get out in the real world.

Market forces didn't end segregation. That took government intervention.
Market forces didn't fight sexual harassment in the workplace. That requires government litigation.
Market forces didn't change "buyer beware" or establish consumer protection. That required government regulation.
...as does worker safety...
...as does environmental protection...
...as does the maintenance of infrastructure...
...and so on...

Operating a business in the public domain requires operating it in a responsible and non-discriminatory manner. That's not "slavery".

You know what is slavery?

Slavery.

That's where you don't get paid for your services. That's where don't work in a safe environment. That's where your master gets to regularly rape your wife and your sons and daughters are sold down the river and you never see them again. That's where you get terrorized, beaten and threatened with death if your services don't satisfy. So knock off the hyperbole that boo hoo, you can't keep the fags out of your bakery. Don't make light of our nation's second greatest shame, second only to the massive genocide of the native population, by claiming that the government stopping you from cramming your beliefs down the throats of others is somehow comparable.

And you'll thank us when Christianity does become the minority to "no religion" and it will remain illegal for an atheist majority to discriminate against you for your goofy beliefs.

I'm probably quite a bit older than you DP.....and somewhat wiser. Let me correct some of the mistakes you an others have made.

First, majorities do not oppress minorities. Groups in power oppress the groups without power. The white minority oppressed the black majority for years in South Africa....but you are probably too young to remember that. I can give you numerous other examples. If you want to stop oppression, don't let power get concentrated. How do you stop power from getting concentrated? Empower the individual...let them have the power.

Second, it was government intervention that caused segregation in the first place. If you knew your history, you would know that African americans were doing a fine job digging themselves out of poverty after slavery. It took government actions like Jim Crow laws and wage regulations to shove them off the economic ladder.

Third, Slavery is absolutely being forced to do something against your will. If you do not want to call it slavery, then call it extortion. No matter what you call it, it isn't pretty. Forcing a baker to provide services to a person he doesn't wish to provide is absolutely slavery. It is economic rape.....It is sad that you advocate such a system.

[SteelCurtain]

Should a gay baker be forced to make a cake that says "God hates fags" on it if his customer chooses so for her anti gay rally? Or a black photographer forced to photograph the wedding of a Grand Dragon's daughter?

The first one, no, the second one, yes. A business isn't required to do anything a client wants. If the gay baker refused the client because he was a Christian and was against gay marriage, then he should be held accountable just the same as the baker in the OP. If a KKK member chose to patronize a black photographer, and he didn't feel that his personal safety was compromised, then yes, he shouldn't be able to refuse his services based on the prospective client's political beliefs. But, if I were asked to do anything for a KKK member, I would be afraid for my life. I would feel like it's a trap or something...

[Heywood]

I just wanna play devil's advocate here for a moment, because I am curious, so I'll ask a couple of questions. As we are talking about whether or not a business should be legally allowed to discriminate against its customers, it seems like the general consensus from mostly everyone here is that a business should not be allowed to do that (an example being the Christian photographer not wanting to take pictures of a gay wedding). I'm curious if this works the other way around for a lot of you. Should a gay baker be forced to make a cake that says "God hates fags" on it if his customer chooses so for her anti gay rally? Or a black photographer forced to photograph the wedding of a Grand Dragon's daughter?

gay-haters and the Klan are not protected classes under the law.....neither are atheists.

You want to know who gets to decide which classes are protected and which are not? The group in power.

[Rampant.A.I.]

Ah, I see. You seem to be one of those who thinks that market forces solves all social ills. I can understand because I used to think the same way. How old are you? 16? 18? You'll learn when you get out in the real world.

Market forces didn't end segregation. That took government intervention.
Market forces didn't fight sexual harassment in the workplace. That requires government litigation.
Market forces didn't change "buyer beware" or establish consumer protection. That required government regulation.
...as does worker safety...
...as does environmental protection...
...as does the maintenance of infrastructure...
...and so on...

Operating a business in the public domain requires operating it in a responsible and non-discriminatory manner. That's not "slavery".

You know what is slavery?

Slavery.

That's where you don't get paid for your services. That's where don't work in a safe environment. That's where your master gets to regularly rape your wife and your sons and daughters are sold down the river and you never see them again. That's where you get terrorized, beaten and threatened with death if your services don't satisfy. So knock off the hyperbole that boo hoo, you can't keep the fags out of your bakery. Don't make light of our nation's second greatest shame, second only to the massive genocide of the native population, by claiming that the government stopping you from cramming your beliefs down the throats of others is somehow comparable.

And you'll thank us when Christianity does become the minority to "no religion" and it will remain illegal for an atheist majority to discriminate against you for your goofy beliefs.

I'm probably quite a bit older than you DP.....and somewhat wiser. Let me correct some of the mistakes you an others have made.

First, majorities do not oppress minorities. Groups in power oppress the groups without power. The white minority oppressed the black majority for years in South Africa....but you are probably too young to remember that. I can give you numerous other examples. If you want to stop oppression, don't let power get concentrated. How do you stop power from getting concentrated? Empower the individual...let them have the power.

Second, it was government intervention that caused segregation in the first place. If you knew your history, you would know that African americans were doing a fine job digging themselves out of poverty after slavery. It took government actions like Jim Crow laws and wage regulations to shove them off the economic ladder.

Third, Slavery is absolutely being forced to do something against your will. If you do not want to call it slavery, then call it extortion. No matter what you call it, it isn't pretty. Forcing a baker to provide services to a person he doesn't wish to provide is absolutely slavery. It is economic rape.....It is sad that you advocate such a system.

Yes. The government caused segregation. That's it. Individuals weren't interested in segregation, or lynchings or cross burning. It was all the government forcing them to do it. Just like the government is forcing cake bakers to discriminate when they don't want to discriminate, but are afraid the government will step in and not let them discriminate.

[Heywood]

Yes. The government caused segregation. That's it. Individuals weren't interested in segregation, or lynchings or cross burning. It was all the government forcing them to do it. Just like the government is forcing cake bakers to discriminate when they don't want to discriminate, but are afraid the government will step in and not let them discriminate.

Separate but equal was a legal doctrine....not an individual one.

Segregation was the result of the The Black Codes , Jim Crow Laws, and court decisions like Plessy vs Ferguson. If you knew your history you would know it was the state that caused segregation.

Had there been no Black Codes, Jim Crow Laws, state mandated segregation, minimum wage, there would have been no Segregation for the state to fix. DP claims the state fixed it but completely forgets or ignores it was the state that caused it in the first place. How did that happen? Well you had a bunch of people in power telling the rest how to behave. I'm sorry but the solution to our social ills isn't a small group of people telling other people how to behave. The solution to our social ills is let people be free.