Science vs Morality

[GrandizerII]

But again, you haven't scientifically explained how pleasure itself should be a measure of someone's worth.

[Mozart Link]

But again, you haven't scientifically explained how pleasure itself should be a measure of someone's worth.

Because without pleasure, then you will have no sense of worth about yourself or others. And if others didn't have pleasure, they would have no sense of worth either.

[Losty]

It's a scientific fact that people who have all the pleasure in the world with a sense of superiority are better people than those who are depressed and humble.

Fuck. Really? There's a branch of science that uses the definition 'people who have all the pleasure in the world with a sense of superiority' and 'better people'?
What is the name of this branch of science?

A scientific fact....yea lol

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But again, you haven't scientifically explained how pleasure itself should be a measure of someone's worth.

Because without pleasure, then you will have no sense of worth about yourself or others. And if others didn't have pleasure, they would have no sense of worth either.

This is probably the best scientific explanation I have ever read, maybe.

[GrandizerII]

But again, you haven't scientifically explained how pleasure itself should be a measure of someone's worth.

Because without pleasure, then you will have no sense of worth about yourself or others. And if others didn't have pleasure, they would have no sense of worth either.

But this is your opinion, not a scientific way of assessing one's worth.

What about in cases of objects? Are modern computers and classic handheld calculators of the same worth because they don't experience pleasure?

Is a baby loved by many of less worth than a serial killer?

[Mozart Link]

Because without pleasure, then you will have no sense of worth about yourself or others. And if others didn't have pleasure, they would have no sense of worth either.

But this is your opinion, not a scientific way of assessing one's worth.

What about in cases of objects? Are modern computers and classic handheld calculators of the same worth because they don't experience pleasure?

Is a baby loved by many of less worth than a serial killer?

What you feel about others is not reality. It's about what you feel about yourself in this case. For example, if you were to feel that a person with no pleasure has worth, since pleasure is worth as pleasure is what gives you a sense of worth in the first place, the fact of the matter is that since this person has no pleasure, then this person has no worth. Therefore, since inanimate objects also have no pleasure, that means they have no worth as well regardless of the fact that you feel they have worth. As for the serial killer, if he/she has more pleasure, then he/she would have more worth than the baby.

[Mudhammam]

What you feel about others is not reality. It's about what you feel about yourself in this case. For example, if you were to feel that a person with no pleasure has worth, since pleasure is worth as pleasure is what gives you a sense of worth in the first place, the fact of the matter is that since this person has no pleasure, then this person has no worth. Therefore, since inanimate objects also have no pleasure, that means they have no worth as well regardless of the fact that you feel they have worth.

I don't think you understand what facts are. It's your opinion that pleasure is worth. People who suffer more don't become worth less, nor does their perspective on their own worth necessarily suffer. This idea of yours that pleasure is the end-all in life is just that: your idea. Nothing more, nothing less.

And this statement:

that means they have no worth as well regardless of the fact that you feel they have worth.

That's just flat out dumb. What do you think worth is? Some intrinsic property that some objects possess independent of minds to apprehend them?

[Losty]

Hmm a serial killer has more worth than a baby....I think maybe a serial killer has a sense of self worth and a baby does not. So a serial killer is more valuable to himself than a baby is valuable to himself.

As far as determining a persons actual worth, it's completely subjective.

Ps. There is absolutely nothing scientific about your argument so far.

[Mozart Link]

I don't think you understand what facts are. It's your opinion that pleasure is worth. People who suffer more don't become worth less, nor does their perspective on their own worth necessarily suffer. This idea of yours that pleasure is the end-all in life is just that: your idea. Nothing more, nothing less.

Now go ahead and tell me which would be better: 1.) Having no pleasure, but having the thought that you are a human being who has worth, or 2.) Having all the pleasure in the world that you are a human being who has worth? The 2nd choice would obviously be better because you obviously, again, would be a mere emotionless robot with no pleasure with just a thought. The concept of something being "better" means more worth. Therefore, since having pleasure would be better than just having a thought with no pleasure, you would have more worth if you had more pleasure.

And this statement:

that means they have no worth as well regardless of the fact that you feel they have worth.

That's just flat out dumb. What do you think worth is? Some intrinsic property that some objects possess independent of minds to apprehend them?

They have no worth (pleasure), but they would have a purpose.

[GrandizerII]

Now go ahead and tell me which would be better: 1.) Having no pleasure, but having the thought that you are a human being who has worth, or 2.) Having all the pleasure in the world that you are a human being who has worth? The 2nd choice would obviously be better because you obviously, again, would be a mere emotionless robot with no pleasure with just a thought. The concept of something being "better" means more worth. Therefore, since having pleasure would be better than just having a thought with no pleasure, you would have no worth if you had no pleasure.

Better in what regard? "Better" is not equivalent to "having more worth".

A car is better than a human being in getting us to places. But a human being is better than a car in giving us advices.

[Losty]

I think I make decent points. Why won't you respond to me? I feel unloved waahhh