Gary Habermas Q and A

[Cato]

I don't understand what Jesus dying by crucifixion has to do with the resurrection claim. The fact this is trotted out as Fact #1 in the minimal facts argument seems bizarre. 

Habermas likes to invoke scholars; however, the same scholars recognize Mark as the first Gospel. The scholars also accept that the original manuscripts of Mark say nothing of Jesus' post burial activities; no appearances, no conversation with disciples and no ascension. As I recently mentioned in another thread, I cannot fathom these events being simply overlooked as inconsequential by the author of Mark. It's much more reasonable to conclude that the post death activities of Jesus were later fabricated. This is bolstered by the fact that those in control chose to 'correct' Mark's lack of attention to detail.

I'm confident Habermas doesn't have a reasonable answer for this, but pinning him down for an answer for the above would be the only compelling reason for me to accept your invitation.

[Randy Carson]

So, my father invited me to his church on Sunday, where Gary Habermas, who is from my area and friends with the pastor of the church, is doing a Q and A at the 11 am service. I have met and talked with Habermas once when he came to town in the past. I was about 14, and went out to lunch with him; I remember him telling me about Antony Flew's consideration of becoming a believer a few years before he publicly came out as a deist. Afterwards he gave me his email if I ever wanted to correspond further, which I don't think I ever did. Anyway, I'm not sure if I want to go, as I'm familiar with his shtick, and I really hate going to church. I'm pretty sure I won't go, actually, though I know it would please my parents and it could even be moderately interesting... though awkward, for sure. What should I do?

If I had had a chance to hear Hitchens, I would have gone, and if Ehrman does a debate in town, I'm almost sure to attend.

Go for it.

And give us a full report.

[Silver]

What should I do?

That is entirely your decision, but never do anything simply to please someone else when it would make you feel uncomfortable.

[Pyrrho]

Nestor, from reading the other replies since mine, I am even more convinced that you should not go.  Of course, if you wanted to go, you should, but you don't, so you shouldn't.

[Jenny A]

Randy and Habermas have the same shtick. If you read Randy's evidence of the resurrection thread you've heard everything Habermas is going to say.

[Minimalist]

The fact this is trotted out as Fact #1 in the minimal facts argument seems bizarre.

Habermas confuses "minimal" evidence with "no fucking evidence" at all.  The only "evidence" is written much later in the self-serving drivel of the author of the first gospel... and copied by the other 3.

It's a shit claim.

[Mudhammam]

My dad also invited my brother. I'm going to see him tomorrow (going to an astronomical observatory in Windsor... holding out it doesn't rain like the forecasters are predicting for later in the night!)... so if I can convince him to go with me I'll definitely go. I don't think I could go by myself. It would be especially uncomfortable because a lot of the people at that church I have known since my Christian days (some of them I have even had debates with on FB in the past), and I hate that sense of overt friendliness I get in churches where people look at you like a soul that needs salvation.

[Pyrrho]

For your sake, I hope your brother has the good sense to refuse to go, and that that will get you to decide to not go.  You will not enjoy going.  You don't seriously expect to hear a genuinely new argument about religion, do you?

When you report back on you going despite my advice, I will be willing to tell you that I told you so, when you tell us that it was horrible.

[Mudhammam]

Ha, believe me, I am pretty much right there already, P.

[Jackalope]

I'd stay home and do something useful, like polish my socks.