Transexuals

[SteelCurtain]

Already got that RedCard, son. And it's pronounced Tar-zhay.

[paulpablo]

Okay, since you have trouble imagining the "wake up with a vagina" scenario, let's try it the other way.

You wake up one day, just as you are. Just as you have always been. You KNOW who you are...

...yet everyone you meet calls you Susan. They refer to you as "she" and "her", and expect you to wear dresses. When you explain that you're really a guy named Paul, you get the most horrible reactions, are cast aside from friends and family and social circles, and are subject to constant fear of attack if you try to just do what you do.

Yes, I'm proposing a similar "magical" scenario, where the roles are reversed, but you really need to understand that in every way that your brain tells you who you are, including what your sense of gender is, they feel the same... the only difference being that their bodies develop according to the chromosomes, not according to the DNA-set which dictates how the "normal" (I use that word loosely, since everything that happens in biology is "normal"; some things just occur more commonly than others) brain develops. Instead, your genetics/epigenetics caused your brain to develop in the way that the female brain normally develops, instead.

Try... try very very hard... to listen to what the trans community is actually telling you about their experiences, instead of projecting your own opinions onto them and failing to empathize. That's why we constantly have to reprimand the theists who come here for doing to us, when they say we "really" worship Satan and are angry at god, or whatever.

I didn't have trouble with the other question, I answered it.  Ok so in this episode of the twilight zone I wake up and I'm being taught a lesson about my not wanting tax money to go towards gender re assignment surgery in most circumstances by remaining who I am but people are calling me Susan and saying "Hey Paul, try this dress on." 

 I might assume I've gone insane and try and get myself therapy, either that or go out and leave my family and friends and get some new friends.

Me having a different opinion from other people about what taxes should go on doesn't automatically mean I lack empathy.  It means I've thought about it and my opinion is that due to the state of the NHS and the waiting times for medical emergencies and lack of funding I'd prioritize emergencies over emotional distress that may or may not be solved by sex re assignment surgery.

It's really arrogant for people to just say "Ok you disagree with me so I know you haven't thought about this as much as I do, you aren't understanding and you lack empathy."

And when people ask "But what about this guy who comes in who's got no penis but a vaginal opening in the middle of his chest and he's got tits on his forehead."  Ok yeah, give him surgery, I already said I'm not rigid in my opinion on this and it would change if circumstances changed.

[I_am_not_mafia]

Ok but can I just show you this article I found.  I don't know how valid it is but I think it's from a fairly reputable source and I'm sure there are counter opinions to the articles conclusions.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn2...ale-brain/

As already posted on this thread, there is plenty of evidence for the difference in male and female brains that has been in the literature for the last few decades and they also show that transsexuals have the brain of the gender that they identify as. I've even read some of them myself.



http://aebrain.blogspot.co.uk/p/transsex...ntity.html


Previously posted here:

http://atheistforums.org/thread-42551-po...pid1248859

Which also included another newscientist link

Transsexual differences caught on brain scan

This is from the article.
“There are not two types of brain”
When the group looked at each individual brain scan, however, they found that very few people had all of the brain features they might be expected to have, based on their sex. Across the sample, between 0 and 8 per cent of people had “all-male” or “all-female” brains, depending on the definition. “Most people are in the middle,” says Joel.

Scans prove there’s no such thing as a ‘male’ or ‘female’ brain

From your very own link:

It reveals that most people have a mix of male and female brain features.

This is consistent with the literature. Using your link to argue that transsexuals do not have brains typical of the gender that they identify with is disingenuous equivocation. Even brains between different species will have much in common because we have all evolved from common ancestors. So it makes sense that male and female brains will be the same design but have different features, or at the very least some features more or less developed than others. There will never be a clear line differentiating the two classes of brains, they will be many overlapping areas. But this still means that you can have brains with predominantly male features and brains with predominantly female features, and other brains sharing many aspects of both.

[I_am_not_mafia]

I don't know about SRS being covered by insurance but I don't think it should be covered by the NHS.  I just don't find it reasonable.  People should be free to change their bodies in that way however they want but not to force other people to pay for it via taxation.

Ah here I see this. What is NHS?

National Health Service. We don't have medical insurance in Britain. Everyone gets free medical care.

[I_am_not_mafia]

National health service.

Does NHS cover mental health care?

Yes.

It can even cover dental care but that's been phased out and generally most people go private for that now.

[I_am_not_mafia]

The NHS certainly could be better, but I've generally found it does a bang up job day to day.

It tends to get no credit for this, and the press jump all over any mishap. I think it's a great institution, and I reckon most of its problems come from government cut backs.

Of course there are problems, and bad staff. It's the same anywhere. I'm not suggesting otherwise. It is something of a lottery as to how good the people are you see, that's one of my biggest concerns with it. I've had excellent treatment, and I've had time wasting idiots.

It's being run down by the tory government so that it can be privatised. It's an age old trick.

[I_am_not_mafia]

Yea, I missed a lot of stuff when I was sleeping xD
And I had been talking to steberben (sp) too so I got mixed up. Sounds like you guys have a crappy health care system. Not as bad as ours but still crappy.

Actually the NHS is a really good health care system, but it is inconsistent. There are some hospitals which are really bad but others which are really good. But it's all free. Most people use it and very few people go private even when they can afford it.

[BrokenQuill92]

http://youtu.be/GuxkpPqZ8PE

[Alex K]

Okay, since you have trouble imagining the "wake up with a vagina" scenario, let's try it the other way.

That's a really interesting perspective.

[Faith No More]

Now, in case anyone was wondering, perpetual douchebag Curt Schilling has put in his two cents on the issue...

“A man is a man no matter what they call themselves,” Schilling, a former Major League Baseball star, wrote in a comment on the photo, according to a screen capture gathered by Outsports. “I don’t care what they are, who they sleep with, men’s room was designed for the penis, women’s not so much. Now you need laws telling us differently? Pathetic.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/21/sports...ender.html