Salieri in Amadeus

[Alex K]

This objectively portays Salieri as unrealistically incompetent.

I'm not versed enough when it comes to classical music, but is this piece actually by Salieri or just some made up tune?

I gather that the writers took one of Mozarts Arias and reverse-engineered from that a mediocre piano piece to present as Salieri's, which Mozart (in the fictional account) would then take as the basis for his aria just for fun.

[Minimalist]

Salieri's Overture to Les Danaides, a very popular French opera from 1784.







There is nothing wrong with this.  In fact, compared to 20th-21st century shit.... it's pretty good.

[Rev. Rye]

Yet there's no idication of Salieri really having felt that way. Miloš Forman just built on the rumors, in the same way as From Hell built on outdated rumors surrounding the Ripper story.

Uh-Uh-Uh. It was Peter Shaffer who built on the rumors. Milos Forman just made them more well-known by taking his play, which built on the rumors, and making it into a movie.

He, so to speak, crafts insanely perfect China for the dining room cabinet while Beethoven composes the roof of the Sistine chapel.

Yeah, and, thanks to this sort of mentality being common in the Classical period, that's why, with the exception of a few names, like Mozart, Haydn, Rossini, maybe opera composers like Gluck and Bellini, a few scattered pieces by Boccherini, and Beethoven (who's usually grouped with the Romantics anyway), much of the music of the Classical Period has fallen out of favour.

[Alex K]

Yeah, and, thanks to this sort of mentality being common in the Classical period, that's why, with the exception of a few names, like Mozart, Haydn, Rossini, maybe opera composers like Gluck and Bellini, a few scattered pieces by Boccherini, and Beethoven (who's usually grouped with the Romantics anyway), much of the music of the Classical Period has fallen out of favour.

Rossini is already a bit of a stretch ...

[Homeless Nutter]

The movie "Amadeus" based on the same play is very entertaining, and has aged rather well for an 80s flick, but without knowing much about Salieri, something seemed very odd about how he was portrayed, basically as a bumbling amateur who could barely write a proper piece of music and was enraged by how Mozart was actually capable of composing nice things.
[...]

Yeah, well - depictions of musicians in popular movies are usually fairly inaccurate. As it turns out, Beethoven - probably wasn't a St Bernard either...

[Alex K]

The movie "Amadeus" based on the same play is very entertaining, and has aged rather well for an 80s flick, but without knowing much about Salieri, something seemed very odd about how he was portrayed, basically as a bumbling amateur who could barely write a proper piece of music and was enraged by how Mozart was actually capable of composing nice things.
[...]

Yeah, well - depictions of musicians in popular movies are usually fairly inaccurate. As it turns out, Beethoven - probably wasn't a St Bernard either...

But how do you explain the line "Alle Hunde werden Brüder" in his 9th, which I always took as a harsh indictment of dog breeding practises?

[abaris]

But how do you explain the line "Alle Hunde werden Brüder" in his 9th, which I always took as a harsh indictment of dog breeding practises?

I like my version better. "Und wir torkeln sturzbetrunken, grölend durch das Heiligtum".

[Alex K]

But how do you explain the line "Alle Hunde werden Brüder" in his 9th, which I always took as a harsh indictment of dog breeding practises?

I like my version better. "Und wir torkeln sturzbetrunken, grölend durch das Heiligtum".

Let's be honest, no one understands what Schiller's lyrics are supposed to mean anyway!

[Rev. Rye]

Yeah, and, thanks to this sort of mentality being common in the Classical period, that's why, with the exception of a few names, like Mozart, Haydn, Rossini, maybe opera composers like Gluck and Bellini, a few scattered pieces by Boccherini, and Beethoven (who's usually grouped with the Romantics anyway), much of the music of the Classical Period has fallen out of favour.

Rossini is already a bit of a stretch ...

Which only further proves my point that the music of the Classical period has suffered largely because of an unusually high proportion of prominent composers who preferred to, as Anomalocaris put it, create china rather than paint the Sistine Chapel. Compared to all the other periods from the Baroque on, the Classical probably has the smallest number of composers whose work still lives on today, and many of those (Rossini, Beethoven, Bellini) probably fit in better with the Romantic idiom anyway. And even of the ones I mentioned, many of them are still fairly obscure (Gluck is slowly gaining ground), and I highly doubt that anyone would count Boccherini among their favourite composers, even in a top 25.

[Homeless Nutter]

But how do you explain the line "Alle Hunde werden Brüder" in his 9th, which I always took as a harsh indictment of dog breeding practises?

I don't think that was meant to be taken literally. It may refer to all members of caninae family. There's nothing there to suggest Ludwig Van Beethoven's actual breed, or even species. Historians don't seem to be able to come up with good evidence - one way or the other. In fact most, if not all of them display disappointingly little interest in the matter - almost as if they were unaware of the issue.

However - latest scientific research suggests, that St Bernards as a breed are not really good at playing piano, or arranging for string quartets, what with them having those large paws and all.

Personally, I'm inclined to believe, that Beethoven was really a couple of badgers in an overcoat and a powdered wig.