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RE: Another Circumcision thread
October 9, 2016 at 1:37 am
(October 9, 2016 at 1:35 am)Excited Penguin Wrote: do you have facts on your hands to disprove her notion that she carried a person inside her, or are you providing your subjective opinion on the matter?
The facts, as quite adequately described by the medical profession, does not consider a fetus in the womb as a "person".
You are quite fucking welcome.
Now perhaps you should learn some facts before you question me again.
"Never trust a fox. Looks like a dog, behaves like a cat."
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RE: Another Circumcision thread
October 9, 2016 at 1:55 am
(This post was last modified: October 9, 2016 at 2:06 am by Aroura.)
(October 9, 2016 at 1:19 am)Maelstrom Wrote: (October 9, 2016 at 1:17 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: My son died at 23 weeks gestation. I can assure you he is/was a person.
I disagree, despite the obvious emotional attachment you had in carrying that fetus for twenty-three weeks.
I am providing you with what you need to hear, not what you want to hear.
Mal, her baby died. I think this one one of those times you can just not argue. Do you really not know when to shut up?
It hurts me to see your need to assert over someone's pain. Her feelings about her baby, fuck I cannot even say. Just don't be a dick to her about this, OK?
She already left us once cause we were being jerks. Please knock it off.
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RE: Another Circumcision thread
October 9, 2016 at 2:21 am
I consider fetuses persons. I don't see why I shouldn't. It is something that becomes a human.
That in some cases mothers may need to end pregnancies to avoid risk to their own well being, is something tragic and something I can understand. But I don't agree with abortions on a whim because people don't know how to avoid a pregnancy to begin with.
I admit I'm not very informed on the subject. Still, that has nothing to do with whether one considers a fetus a person or not. I consider it a person merely because of its potential to become one - that is more than enough for me.
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RE: Another Circumcision thread
October 9, 2016 at 2:37 am
(This post was last modified: October 9, 2016 at 2:40 am by The Grand Nudger.)
You can consider them that, if you like...so could I...but our considering them persons doesn't make them persons. It just means we have opinions, like everyone else. Is a fertilized egg a person, day one? It will also become a human..maybe.
Not related to you, but, I wonder why a person...who thinks a fetus is a person..would not take a knife to that person in the womb, but as soon as they fall out... start hacking them up to serve a fetish?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Another Circumcision thread
October 9, 2016 at 2:42 am
(October 9, 2016 at 2:37 am)Rhythm Wrote: You can consider them that, if you like...so could I...but our considering them persons doesn't make them persons. It just means we have opinions, like everyone else. Is a fertilized egg a person, day one? It will also become a human..maybe.
What does make them persons, Rhythm?
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RE: Another Circumcision thread
October 9, 2016 at 2:43 am
(October 9, 2016 at 2:37 am)Rhythm Wrote: You can consider them that, if you like...so could I...but our considering them persons doesn't make them persons. It just means we have opinions, like everyone else. Is a fertilized egg a person, day one? It will also become a human..maybe.
Not related to you, but, I wonder why a person...who thinks a fetus is a person..would not take a knife to that person in the womb, but as soon as they fall out... start hacking them up to serve a fetish?
Performing a circumcision on a fetus is much riskier than performing it on a baby.
I get your point, but come on with that.
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RE: Another Circumcision thread
October 9, 2016 at 2:45 am
Probably best that you simply refer to the cases, eh? Personhood is a legal status. A fetus doesn't have it. Regardless of whether or not you and I agree with abortion, or whether you and I "see a fetus as a human being" - it simply doesn't have that status.
A newborn baby does, though.....no disagreement from any corner there. -and yet.....
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Another Circumcision thread
October 9, 2016 at 2:47 am
(October 9, 2016 at 2:45 am)Rhythm Wrote: Probably best that you simply refer to the cases, eh? Personhood is a legal status. A fetus doesn't have it. Regardless of whether or not you and I agree with abortion, or whether you and I "see a fetus as a human being" - it simply doesn't have that status.
A newborn baby does, though.....no disagreement from any corner there. -and yet.....
What is and what ought to be are two different things, IMO.
Your response seems to imply that we ought only to talk about what is, whereas I was thinking to take a more progressive approach than that, if possible.
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RE: Another Circumcision thread
October 9, 2016 at 2:52 am
(This post was last modified: October 9, 2016 at 2:54 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Just tryng to help you understand why your objection falls on it's face. A fetus isn't a person, and doesn't become one just because you consider it to be, or because it will "one day be a human being". As I alluded to, a fertilized egg...day one.... will also be a human, one day...and that doesn't make it a person either.
Speaking of misconceptions...I was referring to abortion, above, not the circumcision of a fetus, lol. I find it confusing when a person thinks that it's wrong to harm a fetus, but okay to harm an infant.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Another Circumcision thread
October 9, 2016 at 2:56 am
(This post was last modified: October 9, 2016 at 3:10 am by Excited Penguin.)
(October 9, 2016 at 2:52 am)Rhythm Wrote: Just tryng to help you understand why your objection falls on it's face. A fetus isn't a person, and doesn't become one just because you consider it to be, or because it will "one day be a human being". As I alluded to, a fertilized egg...day one.... will also be a human, one day...and that doesn't make it a person either.
Speaking of misconceptions...I was referring to abortion, above, not the circumcision of a fetus, lol.
No, you're trying to sell me the idea that legal status is somehow necessary for personhood, which is moronic.
A fetus is a person for me, not for the legal system, and not for you, if I were to guess. It still is for me. Now you might argue that doesn't matter for much, but what does that have to do with anything? Are you seriously hiding behind the law in this argument? Stooping that low?
EDIT: Ok, I understand what you were talking about, now, with the knife talk. My apologies.
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