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Can we recover from human caused climate change?
#1
Can we recover from human caused climate change?
With so much political upheaval lately, not just in America but world wide, I feel that I sometimes lose track of the really important things. Economies boom and bust, jobs come and go, social progress inches forward, back a step, then forward again.

But we only have this world. The idea of terraforming Mars seems ludicrous, when we cannot even save our own life giving environment.

I saw Bill Nye, who is stepping more and more out of his role as childrens educator and trying to bring climate change deniers around, on an interview recently. It was horrid to watch. The interviewer stampeded over Bill, asked rapid questions, then ignored the straight forward answers Bill gave and accused him of givong none.
One exchange stuck out. The interviewer asked " What percentage of climate change is caused by humans?", and Bill matter of factly said. "100%". He then went on to try and explain that the rapidity of modern climate change is entirely our fault. It really struck me. He's right.

Modern scientists have now pinned down some numbers. Yes, the climate always changes, but it is now changing at 170 times the normal rate. 170 times! Species are dying off at a rate last seen when the dinosaurs died out, estimated at 140,000 species per year. Look at that number, it's way past alarming! We are killing everything! And a huge percentage of people will simply outright deny it!

My daughter loves nature documentaries, but lately she's been very against them, because almost all are about how this animal or that habitat are threatened, or even those that are already gone. It stresses her out. Hell, it stresses me out, too. Sometimes we'll be talking and something will come up, and she'll ask, does that still exist? Have humans destroyed it yet? It absolutely breaks my heart. What are we leaving to our children, and theirs?

I can get obsessed with trying to do things to be more green. Less driving, very little meat and dairy, buy local, buy seasonal, recycle, turn off electronics, turn down the heat, make my own clothes, can my own fruit, buy in bulk, no plastic containers, etc. I start to feel both overwhelmed and helpless. I'm not stupid. I realize that my impact isn't worth a single grain of sand on a beach. If we all lived 90% greener starting tomorrow, I'm not sure it would be reversible, what we've already done. There are, simply put, too many of us.
Sometimes it all feels futile. Why not just eat whayever I want, drive a monster truck, and comfortably heat my house like the ignorant sods around me? Ill be dead before the shit really hits the fan. But i cant. I cant make myself turn a blind eye, i cant ignore my responsibility as an individual, even if my impact is miniscule.

Can we fix it? I didn't want children, mostly for this reason. When we got pregnant despite precautions, we thought just this one. I was overwhelmed by hormones. And I love her more than my own life! Yet, I still think people having children, particularly more than one or two, is wrong. I cannot help but feel a certain disgust when I see large families. Their selfishness and blatant self inflicted blindness infuriates me. Knowing their children and granchildren will suffer through massive food and water shortages, they don't know, don't care, or don't believe in.

Is there any actual hope? I've yet to see any. Our new EPA guy is all set to rollback pretty much all environmental protections, screw the Paris Accords, and drive us even faster off that looming cliff. Are we inclicting some sort of distopian reality on future generations, but for real?

environment/2017/feb/12/humans-causing-climate-to-change-170-times-faster-than-natural-forces
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocene_extinction

There is a lot more to this topic I'd like to discuss, but this seems enough to be getting on with for this post.
“Eternity is a terrible thought. I mean, where's it going to end?” 
― Tom StoppardRosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead
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#2
RE: Can we recover from human caused climate change?
The issue is not "can we recover" but rather "how many of us will survive" to recover.

If history has taught us anything it is that when resources get scarce humanity can get very violent trying to secure them.  So not only will climate change, famine, disease, and coastal flooding kill us but we'll be bombing the shit out of the survivors trying to steal their shit.
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#3
RE: Can we recover from human caused climate change?
Can we recover? I doubt it. We humans are too stupid to save ourselves, in my opinion.

The "Save the Earth" campaigns should really be called "Save Homo Sapiens".

The planet earth existed long before homo sapiens came along and it'll be here long after we're extinct.

I have a daughter too and I have no idea what life for humanity will be like for her generation and the next. Maybe I'm delusional or in denial but I try not to think about it too much. I can only do the best that I can here and now, since there is so much that is out of my control.
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#4
RE: Can we recover from human caused climate change?
I am puzzled with this weird obsession with the climate changing.

LOL, that problem, no matter how serious it will get, is NOTHING compared to the decline in alkalinity of the oceans.  And that is a direct result of the increased CO2 in the atmosphere dissolving in seawater and forming carbonic acid. The repercussions of that will DWARF global warming.

Now that, is a REAL problem.



No shit.


So don't worry about the current governmental de-emphasis on climate change, and instead, wonder why you yourself is part of the problem in regards to nobody pressing to fix the oceans.
 The granting of a pardon is an imputation of guilt, and the acceptance a confession of it. 




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#5
RE: Can we recover from human caused climate change?
All species go extinct. This idea that we are exceptional is silly. Even in being the architects of our own extinction, that isn't unheard-of.

How it happens isn't relevant to us, for obvious reasons. It may or may not be relevant to surviving life. Hopefully our extinction will allow more intelligent life to arise.

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#6
RE: Can we recover from human caused climate change?
(March 9, 2017 at 10:56 pm)vorlon13 Wrote: I am puzzled with this weird obsession with the climate changing.

LOL, that problem, no matter how serious it will get, is NOTHING compared to the decline in alkalinity of the oceans.  And that is a direct result of the increased CO2 in the atmosphere dissolving in seawater and forming carbonic acid. The repercussions of that will DWARF global warming.

Now that, is a REAL problem.



No shit.


So don't worry about the current governmental de-emphasis on climate change, and instead, wonder why you yourself is part of the problem in regards to nobody pressing to fix the oceans.

Yeah, all part of the same shit.  I  did mention the extinction event. I'm talking about ALL of it.  The oceans have huge dead zones, now.  It's really distressing as well.

(March 9, 2017 at 11:23 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: All species go extinct. This idea that we are exceptional is silly. Even in being the architects of our own extinction, that isn't unheard-of.

How it happens isn't relevant to us, for obvious reasons. It may or may not be relevant to surviving life. Hopefully our extinction will allow more intelligent life to arise.

Right, so this I agree with.  We will go extinct eventually, no doubt.

I guess I worry we will take all life on earth will us.

Hear me out.  Yes, extinction events have happened before.  Yes, life has recovered.  But do you know WHY life recovered?  Because the basis for life was still intact.
This is the very first mass extinction event that includes plants.  Scientists say that during all previous know events, plants, though some died out, never hit MASS extinction.  We have caused plants to be involved, which could mean no chance at recovery for life on this planet.  Period.  Between destroying plants, the atmosphere, and the oceans, the earth could actually become lifeless.

At any rate, knowing we will some day go extinct, does that mean we should give up and just let it happen?  Does it mean we should behave completely irresponsibly? I still think we should make some efforts for future generations.
“Eternity is a terrible thought. I mean, where's it going to end?” 
― Tom StoppardRosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead
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#7
RE: Can we recover from human caused climate change?
We'd be lucky to have only climate change as 'the' problem. Since the decline of alkalinity of the oceans is going to have far more dire consequences than global warming I'm wondering why a priority type approach where all the available resources are diverted to the worst, most threatening problem doesn't even seem to be on the table.
 The granting of a pardon is an imputation of guilt, and the acceptance a confession of it. 




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#8
RE: Can we recover from human caused climate change?
(March 9, 2017 at 11:43 pm)vorlon13 Wrote: We'd be lucky to have only climate change as 'the' problem.  Since the decline of alkalinity of the oceans is going to have far more dire consequences than global warming I'm wondering why a priority type approach where all the available resources are diverted to the worst, most threatening problem  doesn't even seem to be on the table.

I'm wondering why you keep talking about the ocean alkalinity as if it wasn't a part of climate change.  I never mentioned the individual part "Global Warming", but Climate change, of which your issue is an acknowledged part.
“Eternity is a terrible thought. I mean, where's it going to end?” 
― Tom StoppardRosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead
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#9
RE: Can we recover from human caused climate change?
The decline in alkalinity is 95% of the consequences of increasing CO2 in the atmosphere.

Not even a peep in the media about it, just endless droning on cherry blossoms blooming early and teens falling through thin ice in February instead of March.


Let's start talking about the impending global catastrophe and fuck the cherry blossoms.
 The granting of a pardon is an imputation of guilt, and the acceptance a confession of it. 




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#10
RE: Can we recover from human caused climate change?
(March 10, 2017 at 12:05 am)vorlon13 Wrote: The decline in alkalinity is 95% of the consequences of increasing CO2 in the atmosphere.

Not even a peep in the media about it, just endless droning on cherry blossoms blooming early and teens falling through thin ice in February instead of March.


Let's start talking about the impending global catastrophe and fuck the cherry blossoms.

Almost none of the major stuff is in the media. Very little about the dying reefs, the huge dead zones, the number of species that are already gone. There are some reports about overfishing, but they barely even touch the tip of the iceburg with those.
“Eternity is a terrible thought. I mean, where's it going to end?” 
― Tom StoppardRosencrantz and Guildenstern Are Dead
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