The unnatural deity

[Silver]

I have lately seen the argument by theists that god is not supernatural because he is a natural aspect of our reality.

Their argument fails because if this was remotely true there would be a valid way to discern god from all that is natural in our world. Such an apologist argument is flimsy and proves that theists are not even trying any more. They are simply pulling nonsense out of their asses, granted as they have always done, in order to defend a religious belief that is quite unreasonable.

The god concept is purely the product of man's imagination, natural only in the trait that defines it as fictional.

[Belacqua]

I have lately seen the argument by theists that god is not supernatural because he is a natural aspect of our reality.

Where have you seen this argument? 

It certainly goes against all traditional theology, which would never describe God as an "aspect" of anything.

Their argument fails because if this was remotely true there would be a valid way to discern god from all that is natural in our world.

Why do you think that there must be a way to discern god from other things? Would this be an empirical way, or a logical way? 

I'm not saying you're wrong, I just wonder what your argument is.

[The Grand Nudger]

There’s only one subset of theism that has a problem with god being an aspect of nature, and it’s “traditional theology” was directly ripped from people who believed precisely that.

[Chad32]

I've only heard the argument that he's outside of space and time, so you can't use natural means to find him. I think the supernatural thing is just something they don't like, because it's comparable to other things. Like saying what he does is magic, because he's speaking things into existence. Christianity isn't a religion. It's a personal relationship. They fight so hard to sell their woo as something different from all the other stuff. 


There's a long list of creator gods Humanity has come up with. There's even a pretty good list of savior's that died for everyone's sins. Once you find this out, if you still feel the need to argue that yours is special, be my guest. Just don't act surprised when people like me give up on religion after they find out your omni everything creator started out as a lesser god from the Canaanite pantheon.

[Drich]

I have lately seen the argument by theists that god is not supernatural because he is a natural aspect of our reality.

Their argument fails because if this was remotely true there would be a valid way to discern god from all that is natural in our world. Such an apologist argument is flimsy and proves that theists are not even trying any more. They are simply pulling nonsense out of their asses, granted as they have always done, in order to defend a religious belief that is quite unreasonable.

The god concept is purely the product of man's imagination, natural only in the trait that defines it as fictional.

that's not the arguement smart guy..

The arguement is Why would the God of the natural universe create it in such a way as being mandated to do everything supernaturally when he wills it?

Think about if if you are going to create "everything" then why oh why would you do it in such a way as to mandate this creation to fight you everytime you want something done. Rather if you are going to create a dimension and all of it's laws would it not then make sense to do so in such a way that all of nature is in compliance with how you want reality to play out?

Or if that is too big for a small mind to take in.. here another way of looking at it:
God is not mandated to be supernatural. it is the people who saw God work through what ever means he employs are way too complex for bronze age men to understand. so rather than describe the mechanical or technological means something God did was accomplished they only record the net result. So rather than explain jesus took a medicine from his cloak mixed with very fine pumice he found on the ground and hydrated this mixture with his own purified salivia and mixed it into a man's eyes to scrub out a scale build up over the lens of the eye so a blind man could see and the scale layer fell to the ground., we get jesus spit in the dirt rubbed it in a mans eyes and scales fell and the man could see.

The point is you in your little box/mind need god to be a magic man so you can use almight science to make him go away... The problem is the bible does not say God is a magic man... only that bronze age men could not describe him any other way.

Which begs the question if science where to look at God and verify he was who he said he is how would you douche bags try and play down the fact he was God how would you lable him? He would be identified as a transdimensional being with tech and only cybernetic or psychic ability to manipulate matter on a atomic level either by will or technology or a combination of both... You guys would not acknowledge this being as God simply because in your little minds God needs to be an old wizard.. When nothing but your own small minds demands he should be.