Question for Rayaan (or Ziggy)

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

I posted this on another thread,but thought you might have missed it:

Another question,if you don't mind,something which confuses me.

I lived in Malaysia,a Muslim country since the 12th century,where Sunni Islam is the State religion. I had some good Muslim fiends,in a local kampong,and had some nice chats with the revered village Hadj. These were devout people. I was accepted as a person of The Book, and always treated with great respect, wonderful hospitality, and kindness.

My question: The Qur'an seems quite specific about People of The Book (Jews and Christians specifically although the term is contentious) AND their status under Sharia law as Dhimmi.


BUT throughout parts of Islam,there is a deep and abiding hatred of both Jews and Christian, EG at present the murder of Christians in Iraq has become an international scandal.

It is my observation that very good people can be led to do evil things in the name of religion.Do you know off hand some of the sura and Hadith used by extremists to justify anti Jewish and anti Christian acts?

This is not an attack on Islam. I really want to understand the mindset of such people. Because of my own experiences with Islam and Muslims, I do not see the religion as evil or even innately violent. I think those perceptions probably come from cherry picking the Qur'an and a misunderstanding of the word 'jihad'.(struggle)

[Justtristo]

I posted this on another thread,but thought you might have missed it:

Another question,if you don't mind,something which confuses me.

I lived in Malaysia,a Muslim country since the 12th century,where Sunni Islam is the State religion. I had some good Muslim fiends,in a local kampong,and had some nice chats with the revered village Hadj. These were devout people. I was accepted as a person of The Book, and always treated with great respect, wonderful hospitality, and kindness.

My question: The Qur'an seems quite specific about People of The Book (Jews and Christians specifically although the term is contentious) AND their status under Sharia law as Dhimmi.


BUT throughout parts of Islam,there is a deep and abiding hatred of both Jews and Christian, EG at present the murder of Christians in Iraq has become an international scandal.

It is my observation that very good people can be led to do evil things in the name of religion.Do you know off hand some of the sura and Hadith used by extremists to justify anti Jewish and anti Christian acts?

This is not an attack on Islam. I really want to understand the mindset of such people. Because of my own experiences with Islam and Muslims, I do not see the religion as evil or even innately violent. I think those perceptions probably come from cherry picking the Qur'an and a misunderstanding of the word 'jihad'.(struggle)

I would need to read the Quran again in order to answer this question.

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

I would need to read the Quran again in order to answer this question. However here is the first sura of the Quran

Oops ------------------------------????????????????

[Justtristo]

I would need to read the Quran again in order to answer this question. However here is the first sura of the Quran

Oops ------------------------------????????????????

Sorry I did not delete the final sentence when I was editing the post.

[annatar]

.Do you know off hand some of the sura and Hadith used by extremists to justify anti Jewish and anti Christian acts?

Here you go;

O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies. They are [in fact] allies of one another. And whoever is an ally to them among you - then indeed, he is [one] of them. Indeed, Allah guides not the wrongdoing people.
(5:51)
I remember more verses like that though Im not sure.

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

.Do you know off hand some of the sura and Hadith used by extremists to justify anti Jewish and anti Christian acts?

Here you go;

O you who have believed, do not take the Jews and the Christians as allies. They are [in fact] allies of one another. And whoever is an ally to them among you - then indeed, he is [one] of them. Indeed, Allah guides not the wrongdoing people.
(5:51)
I remember more verses like that though Im not sure.

Thanks, a good start.

[annatar]

I have found some more;
Indeed, the religion in the sight of Allah is Islam. And those who were given the Scripture did not differ except after knowledge had come to them - out of jealous animosity between themselves. And whoever disbelieves in the verses of Allah , then indeed, Allah is swift in [taking] account. (3:19)

The Jews say, "Ezra is the son of Allah "; and the Christians say, "The Messiah is the son of Allah ." That is their statement from their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved [before them]. May Allah destroy them; how are they deluded?(9:30)

They have certainly disbelieved who say, " Allah is the Messiah, the son of Mary" while the Messiah has said, "O Children of Israel, worship Allah , my Lord and your Lord." Indeed, he who associates others with Allah - Allah has forbidden him Paradise, and his refuge is the Fire. And there are not for the wrongdoers any helpers.(5:72)
These are spesifically against christians and jews. But there are more verses that curses those who do not believe in quran.

I think those perceptions probably come from cherry picking the Qur'an and a misunderstanding of the word 'jihad'.(struggle)

Actually its quite opposite. Civilized muslims are cherry picking the verses and misunderstanding quran. Extremists are quite right about their religion... But its same for christians. They stopped going crusades not because bible is peaceful. Its because they have became civilized enough to ignore the violent parts of their religion...

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

Actually its quite opposite

I can understand why you might think so. My experience is different and possibly more varied,so I'm unable to share your opinion. I make no truth claims.

[annatar]

Trust me, I know about moderate muslims. I was one of them for a long time... I was thinking that extremists don't get the quran right and islam is actually religion of peace. Then I read the quran(several times) and saw it was not the case. There are a lot of verse and hadith to justify their violent actions. Of course there are some peaceful verses too and people can live peacefully as many people here in Turkey. But the religion itself isn't tolerant or peaceful. Its just people trying to be nice in spite of their religion.

[Rayaan]

I posted this on another thread, but thought you might have missed it:

Nah, I didn't miss it. I was just taking a longer time to reply.

There are some days when I don't have enough leisure time to post in the forum. So, sometimes you have to wait a little bit longer to get a reply from me. But I do read all the threads and posts in the Islamic subforum even if they get buried under several other threads. I don't miss anything. Also, I like to organize my thoughts together and do more research before posting a reply.

I'm going to make another post regarding your question and also on what annatar said. While you're waiting for the reply, please read the two articles below:

(1) Is there Anti-Semitism in the Quran? and (2) Can Muslims be friends with Jews and Christians?