I am curious about islam

[Senshi]

Marsellus Wallace teezak hamra, are you ex-muslim or ex-coptic?

[Marsellus Wallace]

Marsellus Wallace teezak hamra, are you ex-muslim or ex-coptic?

How do you insult me in arabic? Are you afraid to look stupid to the forum members ?

You're just another kid.....

[Wyrd of Gawd]

I would say of all of the major religions, Islam is the worst. Doctrinally it's the worst and more importantly, in reality it is the worst. In Islam there is no room for the separation of church and state. Islam is a specific doctrine for how the state should be run. Where as most other religions have come around to the reality of the benefits of a secular state. In addition Islam is an obvious fraud. So much of their doctrine is obviously made up by a male in the middle east in the middle ages. Take for instance the fasting from dawn til dusk in Ramadan. Well because the Islamic calendar is lunar, Ramadan changes season periodically. Therefore sometimes Ramadan falls in the summer. Do you expect Swedish with 20 hours of daylight to just not eat for a whole month? A pretty dumb oversight for an almighty God, but an obvious one for a male from a place in the world where daylight doesn't vary that much. Islam is full of such inconsistencies that simply couldn't be made by an omnipotent being. Mind you all of this is without mentioning the obvious stereotypes about terrorism, rape, the repression of women, etc.

Despite all of its faults, the Islamic doctrine isn't racist like Judaism and Christianity are. And compared to Old Testament Judaism, Islam is a lot more liberal. But they are both repressive, sort of like living in New York City.

[Zidneya]

Watch this.






So tell me ThePaleolithicFreethinker. Are you still curious about Islam?

[Subhan Ahmad]

What is this religion about? I would like to know if anyone can answer.

Bro,if you are curious about Islam then ask an Islamic scholar who could guide you. Do you think this is the right place to explore Islam?

Anyways, what can I tell you is that Islam is a religion as well as a code of life that contains guidelines for every aspect of human life. The fundamental of these guidelines is peace, mercy, justice and forgiveness.
It is the oldest religion which started when Adam and Eve (peace be upon them) were sent to earth and completed with the last last prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Between this time, many other prophets came like Moses and Jesus (peace be upon them) and spread the message of God that was essentially the same.
A muslim believes and has faith in only one God. He or she acknowledges all the prophets from Adam to Prophet Muhammad (Peace be Upon him). We believe in the "unseen" like angles, jinns and fate. We also believe in the day of judgement when EVERY single person will be answerable to his or her actions he or she did during the life time. No only one will be accountable for other's actions. On the basis of every individuals own actions, God will separate good and evil people forever (you know very well that good and bad is living together in this world right now). Good and virtuous people will have eternal heaven while the evil and arrogant will be in eternal hell. So life here is temporary and we all have to return one day to God. This life is a test to prove who you really are and what are you worth.
Bro, I will again suggest you to seek a muslim scholar for a better understanding. Thank You.

[Minimalist]

How is halal meat prepared?

They stone it to death.

[Subhan Ahmad]

How is halal meat prepared?

They stone it to death.

No bro, first halal means anything that is permissible and lawful. Halal food is all the food that is permissible for a muslim to consume. I am posting you a wiki link. Hope it would be helpful to you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_dietary_laws

[Hoopington]

What is this religion about? I would like to know if anyone can answer.

Bro,if you are curious about Islam then ask an Islamic scholar who could guide you. Do you think this is the right place to explore Islam?

Anyways, what can I tell you is that Islam is a religion as well as a code of life that contains guidelines for every aspect of human life. The fundamental of these guidelines is peace, mercy, justice and forgiveness.

I think this, of all the lines spouted about this abhorrent religion, is the one that makes me want to puke. One verse, please tell me what is peaceful, merciful, just or forgiving about this:

Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing...
but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

It is the oldest religion which started when Adam and Eve (peace be upon them) were sent to earth and completed with the last last prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Between this time, many other prophets came like Moses and Jesus (peace be upon them) and spread the message of God that was essentially the same.

Actually, of the major theistic religions, it's the youngest. Just because Mo and his chums decided to piggy back onto a bunch of stories that already existed, it doesn't make it the oldest.

A muslim believes and has faith in only one God. He or she acknowledges all the prophets from Adam to Prophet Muhammad (Peace be Upon him). We believe in the "unseen" like angles, jinns and fate. We also believe in the day of judgement when EVERY single person will be answerable to his or her actions he or she did during the life time. No only one will be accountable for other's actions. On the basis of every individuals own actions, God will separate good and evil people forever (you know very well that good and bad is living together in this world right now). Good and virtuous people will have eternal heaven while the evil and arrogant will be in eternal hell. So life here is temporary and we all have to return one day to God. This life is a test to prove who you really are and what are you worth.
Bro, I will again suggest you to seek a muslim scholar for a better understanding. Thank You.

A test eh?

How do you believe this shit?

[Subhan Ahmad]

I think this, of all the lines spouted about this abhorrent religion, is the one that makes me want to puke. One verse, please tell me what is peaceful, merciful, just or forgiving about this:

Quran (2:191-193) - "And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing...
but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone. But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

Bro, first of all I hope that you are asking questions with a sincere intention to understand a muslim belief so we can understand each other's point of view. I am not a muslim scholar. I will try to be as helpful as I can be and will explain as accurately as my knowledge allows me.

Bro the value and importance of single human life in islam can be understood from this verse:

"Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely. And our messengers had certainly come to them with clear proofs. Then indeed many of them, [even] after that, throughout the land, were transgressors." (5:32)

About the verses you quoted, first you have not stated the whole verses related to this subject in the this chapter. Verse (2:190) is also part of this subject which states:
"Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors.".

You also have not written the whole translation. I will highlight the text you skipped.
"And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah is worse than killing. And fight not with them at Al-Masjid-al-Haram (the sanctuary at Makkah), unless they (first) fight you there. But if they attack you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers. But if they cease, then Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allah (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.)"

Skipping a snigle line can distort the whole context and message. So read the Quran carefully and also seek guidance from a muslim scholar. These verses were directed towards the pagans of Makkah who forced Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him) and his followers out of Makkah and migrate to Madinah. This migration was done after 13 years of EXTREME oppression and torture by the pagans of Makkah on the Prophet and the Muslims only because they Believed in one God only and seeked social justice which lacked at that time. After the migration, these verses ordered the muslims to fight back and kill the disbelievers who killed them, to drive out the disbelievers and the wrong doers who drove them out. Bro, for 13 years pagans oppressed the muslims and Prophet (peace be upon him) to the extreme only becasue they disbelieved polytheism and even after migration they threatened muslims in every possible way. So these are the guidelines for the muslims when they face such a situation.

I have mentioned that Islam is the complete code of life and contains every aspects of life INCLUDING warfare. I guess you have read "Art of war". These verses deal with warfare. Muslim can go on war:
1) When muslims are attacked, we are allowed to attack in defense.
2) When muslims are oppressed and are forced to not practice their faith
3) Muslims can go on offensive too when they are constantly seriously threatened by others but not to transgress when the threat is eliminated.
4) Again we are allowed to attack when the other nation continuously violates peace treaty.
5) If muslims are invaded, killed and forced to leave their homeland then it is must for a muslim to fight back.
6) Most important bro, muslims are not allowed to go on war to make non muslims believe in islam. Quran states:
"There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing." (2:256)

You can not even force a child born in islamic family to believe in Islam. I know this is not usually practiced but it is the human error not the error in Islam. You know parents get over protective.

Further things to be noted..
1) during war or invasion, muslims are not allowed to kill any innocent, women, child. weak and old people.
2) Muslims are not allowed to destroy any property unless it is used by the enemy as a shield and there is no other way to take out the enemy.
3) Muslims are allowed to invade a non muslim country if citizens whether muslims or non-muslims are oppressed to extreme. The objective would only be fight as long as the oppressor (government, military or king) gives up their malpractices and corruption. We are STRICTLY not allowed to invade any where for gaining riches and land of this world. Muslims are not allowed to invade a country to take their oil reserves.
4) Muslims are not allowed to break any peace treaty if made.
5) In war, if the enemy surrenders and extends hand for peace. Muslims are advised to be kind and accept the treaty. But if the enemy breaks treaty and become violent again after coming back to power then muslims are allowed to kill such an enemy wherever they find them in war.

Actually, of the major theistic religions, it's the youngest.

Nope, Islam never ever claimed to be anything new. What it claimed to be is the same message passed to every prophet. We believe and respect all the prophets from Adam to Muhammad (Peace be upon them). This also includes Moses and Jesus (peace be upon them). Every prophet prophesied Muhammad (Peace be Upon him) and to follow his teachings when he arrives. Though jews and christians won't admit, there are many evidence in their own scriptures. I am sorry but you have to search these evidences yourself or ask a muslim scholar. Internet will be helpful.

A test eh?

How do you believe this shit?

Yes bro I do with all my heart.
To explain this, I will put some Quranic verses infront first:

"The good deed and the evil deed cannot be equal. Repel (the evil) with one which is better (i.e. Allah ordered the faithful believers to be patient at the time of anger, and to excuse those who treat them badly), then verily! he, between whom and you there was enmity, (will become) as though he was a close friend." (41:34)

"Say (O Muhammad SAW): "Not equal are Al-Khabith (all that is evil and bad as regards things, deeds, beliefs, persons, foods, etc.) and At-Taiyib (all that is good as regards things, deeds, beliefs, persons, foods, etc.), even though the abundance of Al-Khabith (evil) may please you." So fear Allah much [(abstain from all kinds of sins and evil deeds which He has forbidden) and love Allah much (perform all kinds of good deeds which He has ordained)], O men of understanding in order that you may be successful." (5:100)

What does God means when He says good and bad can not be equal ?
For example if you talk to me politely and decently but I respond to you with arrogance. Do you think your's and mine attitude is equal ? Do you think politeness and arrogance can be same and equal ? I believe not.

Another. Suppose two person A and B. A is a middle class person who works hard for honest living, is honest to people, is satisfied and happy with what he has. A has never harmed a single innocent person. Whenever he faces any trouble, he doesn't seek wrong means to over come it instead face it patiently.

B on the other hand is a rich greedy person in mafia, who cheats people and does whatever it takes to live a luxurious and comfortable life. Whenever he face a trouble he breaks all the laws to overcome his troubles.

Suppose both A and B die at the age of 60. Is life of A is equal and same as life of B? If there is no after life then both are equal i.e. DEAD. If the life of A and B is not equal and same then why the outcome is Death for both ? I and other muslims don't believe that.

Another example very important example, A terrorist blasts down a building and kill hundreds of people is later caught and executed. Do you think destorying life of hundereds and their families can be compensated with a single life of a terrorist? Do you think this is true justice? I don't believe that.

That is why God says in Quran again and again that good and bad can and will NEVER EVER be equal. And He promises again and again that He will seperate good from bad or evil on the day of judgement. Whatever we are doing either publicly or privately is being thoroughly recorded. So every individual will be handed the record of all his or her good an bad deeds they did in their lives so they be witness of themselves that whether they fall in the category of good people (if excess of good deeds) or the evil people (excess of evil deed). For the faithful, righteous and patient will be eternal heaven and for the unfaithful, and wrongdoers is eternal hell. This is what I believe is justice.

This is what I believe is a critical flaw in atheism. No matter what a person does, even kill humanity or bring chaos, he or she is gonna die anyway like the rest he or she killed and rot like the rest and that's it. Do you really think and believe that's it?

Anyways, if you would like to know more let me know but again a muslim scholar is a better option. Best of luck

[Marsellus Wallace]

@Subhan Ahmad , wow . Thats a long post, man.

I read some of it and I can give you one tip, look for the contradictions to the verses you are showing to us and you will surely find them, start there .