A common denominator in great people

[Thumpalumpacus]

Churchill and E.O. Wilson come to mind.

What exactly made Churchill great in your opinion? He's only ever defined over his role in WWII, but the rest of his life wasn't all that glorious.

I wouldn't put any politician in that category, but only people who really pushed humanity forward. And that list would be endless, starting with many roman and greek philosophers and authors. The most defining feature, in my view, is going against and breaking up the mainstream of their times.

The many different things he did -- politician is the most famous, but he was one hell of a writer. He was also a journalist who escaped captivity in the Boer War.

But as a writer he was very productive well into old age, which is what I gather this thread is about.

[Brian37]

"Great" people is a point of view and even with that Sagan got it right that no matter if you are rich or poor, friend or fo famous or obscure, just like the current population wasn't around 4 billion years ago, none of us will be around 4 billion years from now.

Great how? How many people here outside historians can name every single Pharaoh in the 3,000 year history of the ancient Egyptian dynasty? How many here can name every singly United States President?

How many "great" bands have you seen locally you think deserve to be famous but never get famous? Those people you mention at that top had tons of thinkers and scientists they built their thoughts off of and educators that put that information in their brains.

I don't like the word "great". I think instead the reason we like what they say is because of their education and their empathy, not because they are "great". Non famous people whom you will never know also agree with them, probably do lots of kind things and great things you will never hear about.

My poetry for example lots of people read, some love it, some hate it, but the there were countless people who did far more work collectively that I drew my ideas on that you will never know. When you attempt to define "great" in reality you are really doing no different in setting up your own type of hero worship by using that word "great".

Those people were human beings just like you and me. Their thoughts and ideas you like sure. But the common thing all famous friends and foes have is that they stand on others to get to the top. "Great" is a POV term. Evolution is a science and in science all humans have it within themselves to be either cruel or compassionate.

[Quatermass]

One common denominator that I find interesting is that many of the 'Greats' were outside of their field (at least in the area of invention). The Wright Brothers, for example, were bicycle engineers, while Alexander Graham Bell was a Philologist.

[Anomalocaris]

Certainly not Gallipoli.

Which itself was to cover for the fact that he personally helped push the Turks into the central power block.

[Brian37]

One common denominator that I find interesting is that many of the 'Greats' were outside of their field (at least in the area of invention). The Wright Brothers, for example, were bicycle engineers, while Alexander Graham Bell was a Philologist.

I have no problem with those who want to do anything in life big or small. I simply hate the word "great" being used to describe people. The famous people we like are still just human beings like us.

[Lemonvariable72]

I'm definitely more in the stage of generating a hypotheses then confirming one. Hence I'm not searching for a control group just yet

When you get there you will need at least three other groups:  long-lived and productive but not particularly intelligent; intelligent but short lived for reasons other than violent death;  ordinary but long lived.   You are also going to have to adjust lifespan for generation and environment.  Human lifespan varies tremendously with time and place.

and why do I need to do that?

[Hatshepsut]

"Great" people is a point of view...

Rejection of "Great Man" theories is a politically motivated liberal thing, natural because liberals value equality. Yet it's clear that some people do matter more than others by almost any meaningful criterion. I agree with the notion that ideas or inventions may come approximately when the time is ripe for them; i.e. the airplane would have been invented pretty soon if the Wright brothers hadn't done it. But not just anyone can invent planes and it's clear we do have intellectual leaders who take the initiative. It might be better to speak of a "Great Pool" who drive progress rather than crediting only individuals.

...live long lives and continue produce good works very late in their lives?

You could try George Bernard Shaw, who wrote plays in his nineties. There is a known correlation between IQ and longevity, though I don't think any genetic basis has yet been shown for it. High IQ folks tend to get better jobs and thus better housing, diet, working conditions, and health care. They can advocate for themselves more effectively when injustice strikes.

The only two common denominators I see in persons who are later recognized as "great" are that they attracted followings and that they pursued goals we find morally or intellectually desirable. The latter just rules out the "anti-greats" like Napoleon. In a few cases there's no large following either, as with discovered "greats" like the Dr. Snow who convinced the London town fathers to remove the handle from the Broad Street pump, thus stopping the Cholera epidemic in 1854.

[Dystopia]

Since this isnt' a list merely about good people I would add Mussolini because he theorized fascism and shaped both Italian culture forever and inspired drastic changes in Europe and possibly if Hitler inspired himself on Mussolini it pretty much caused WWII.

[Hatshepsut]

I would add Mussolini because he theorized fascism...

Wasn't Alfredo Rocco the theorist in Italy? I thought Mussolini was just the guy who looked impressive in shiny black boots and knew how to make himself look foolish doing the thuggery on Ethiopia, but maybe I'm wrong.....

[Dystopia]

The Doctrine Of Fascism by Benito Mussolini is an impressive work propaganda wise - If we are talking about theory we could discuss Platonism/Plato and people from a long time ago who had views that were close to what we consider fascism. I'm just saying Mussolini shaped the history of Europe in the XX century - All other fascists came after him. This was terrible but good because we learned a lot on how valuable freedom can be