(September 11, 2015 at 1:52 pm)Crossless1 Wrote:

(September 11, 2015 at 1:31 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote: I'm not really worried. I'd be surprised if I found one atheist who seriously disagreed with my statement.

Ace, if you do some searching, you will find numerous threads in which people make precisely that same point: atheism =/= science.

Though many atheists are metaphysical naturalists and would assert a close relationship between atheism and science, not all are.  I would go so far as to say that a majority of atheists are likely agnostic on the question of metaphysical naturalism, while at the same time embracing methodological naturalism.  Hell, one could be an atheist and a full-blown New Age, astrology-believing loon.  There is no real content to the concept of 'atheist' other than 'doesn't believe in gods'.

That's why I go on, as often as I'm given space to do so, to tell people that I'm an agnostic atheist and  a Secular Humanist.

To those who don't know what all that means, or to those whose preachers deliberately conflate the terms in order to score points on behalf of their flocks of congregants, it may sound redundant... but in order, they are: a "knowledge-philosophy", a conclusion, and a specific set of principles which most-closely match my own personal set, enough so that I am comfortable adopting the title.

In Christian circles, one might say, equivalently, that they are a revelationist theist and a Southern Baptist Christian.

(September 11, 2015 at 1:36 pm)Losty Wrote: If you cut off your arms just because you didn't like them and not for a medical reason, that's a cosmetic purpose. Derp.

No, it is actually known as Body integrity identity disorder (BIID, also referred to as amputee identity disorder) is a psychological disorder wherein people feel they would be happier living as an amputee, or being "transabled." It is related to xenomelia, "the oppressive[clarification needed] feeling that one or more limbs of one's body do not belong to one's self".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_integrity

(September 11, 2015 at 2:34 pm)Ace Wrote:

(September 11, 2015 at 1:36 pm)Losty Wrote: If you cut off your arms just because you didn't like them and not for a medical reason, that's a cosmetic purpose. Derp.

No, it is actually known as Body integrity identity disorder (BIID, also referred to as amputee identity disorder) is a psychological disorder wherein people feel they would be happier living as an amputee, or being "transabled." It is related to xenomelia, "the oppressive[clarification needed] feeling that one or more limbs of one's body do not belong to one's self".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_integrity

No, that's mental disorder. You're discussing a reason someone might want to amputate. The actual act of amputation would still be for cosmetic purposes as it would have no medical value. *yawn* why are we still discussing this?

I don't think it should be illegal if the person wanting to do it is a mentally stable adult. I do not find it to be immoral for a person to cut off their own body parts. I don't care how you feel about it.

(September 11, 2015 at 2:34 pm)Ace Wrote:

(September 11, 2015 at 1:36 pm)Losty Wrote: If you cut off your arms just because you didn't like them and not for a medical reason, that's a cosmetic purpose. Derp.

No, it is actually known as Body integrity identity disorder (BIID, also referred to as amputee identity disorder) is a psychological disorder wherein people feel they would be happier living as an amputee, or being "transabled." It is related to xenomelia, "the oppressive[clarification needed] feeling that one or more limbs of one's body do not belong to one's self".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_integrity

For your premise to be true, Ace, we would have to say that just because there are people with a disorder that makes them get too much cosmetic surgery, due to mental illness, that anyone who has breast augmentation or a facelift is off their rocker.

And the specific choice of Losty to use arm amputation is a random concept she picked to show the idea of bodily integrity, and our right to make what choices we want with our own selves, if it is the product of a reasoned decision rather than mental illness. For you to bring mental illness related to her one specific example back into the equation is something of a red herring.

(September 11, 2015 at 2:47 pm)Losty Wrote: No, that's mental disorder. You're discussing a reason someone might want to amputate. The actual act of amputation would still be for cosmetic purposes at it would have no medical value. *yawn* why are we still discussing this?

I don't think it should be illegal if the person wanting to do it is a mentally stable adult. I do not find it to be immoral for a person to cut off their own body parts.

WOW . . .I cant even see how amputation is leading to cosmetic surgery or what I even originally said lead to cosmetic surgery
This was my original statement:----

No, it should not be considered acceptable for anyone to allow any person, even with their freely give consent, to be sacrificed. It is no different than allowing a person to have their arms amputated because they don't like them and it is their body to do as the wish.

Now how you got cosmetic surgery out of that, i have not idea. At no time was I even taking about damn cosmetic surgery. Which is were you obviously want to take it for some reason, I don't know either to wanting to do cosmetic surgery or for sexual reassignment. What ever the reason that is a totally different issue and not at all what I was talking about that!

Like you say with same sex marriage "like or not, that is the Law!

(September 11, 2015 at 2:47 pm)Losty Wrote: I don't care how you feel about it.

HAHAHAHA YES THERE IT IS, THERE IT IS!!!! ! I know you could not hide! There is that condescendingg self-showing  face yours!!! I was wondering when you were going to show up.  

You might want to think of the other (dare I say it? I mean you are suppose to be empathetic, right?) person, who you, (YES YOU) start to engaging in a conversion with anther persons over their comments and ideas. Especially  if in the end "you don't care how they feel about it."

If you don't care for the other person in the conversation thoughts or feelings, then please don't ask them any question or to further explain themselves. Hell don't replay to their post at all. It will save everyone time and energy.

Why am I supposed to be empathetic? Every time I talk you complete ignore my point and go off on a tangent about something else entirely. I said amputation for cosmetic purposes. I am talking about the same fucking thing as you and saying that it is not for medical reasons. Your reading comprehension sucks. I know it's not your fault but it makes it extremely difficult to have a conversation with you. I never care about someone's feelings in a debate. I want you to either show how it's immoral or move on to another topic.

(September 11, 2015 at 3:24 pm)TheRocketSurgeon Wrote:

(September 11, 2015 at 2:34 pm)Ace Wrote: No, it is actually known as Body integrity identity disorder (BIID, also referred to as amputee identity disorder) is a psychological disorder wherein people feel they would be happier living as an amputee, or being "transabled." It is related to xenomelia, "the oppressive[clarification needed] feeling that one or more limbs of one's body do not belong to one's self".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_integrity

For your premise to be true, Ace, we would have to say that just because there are people with a disorder that makes them get too much cosmetic surgery, due to mental illness, that anyone who has breast augmentation or a facelift is off their rocker.

And the specific choice of Losty to use arm amputation is a random concept she picked to show the idea of bodily integrity, and our right to make what choices we want with our own selves, if it is the product of a reasoned decision rather than mental illness. For you to bring mental illness related to her one specific example back into the equation is something of a red herring.

I was the one who brought up the amputation of army not Lostly, (again) as an example. Because originally I was only taking about self amputation, not about self cosmetic surgery. Self amputation, self amputation, which is completely different. Noting is wrong with the person. The are completely healthy. They do not want to change their appearance by changing their nose. All they want is to cut parts of their body off, that is it. I was not at all taking about  cosmetic or medical reasons.

How Losty got lost in the discussion and ended up with topic of self cosmetic surgery I have no Idea.

(I did post to you, I don't know if you saw it, but it was about how many misuse or take the wrong thing or the example and go a total different way with the topic. Forgoing the actually idea or concept of the original argument to begin with)

FML seriously I was talking about self amputation the whole time. All I said was it was for cosmetic purposes. In case you're wondering that doesn't change it to a nose job. I'm still talking about amputation of a limb and just clarifying that it is for non medical purposes (aka cosmetic purposes)

(September 11, 2015 at 3:32 pm)Losty Wrote: Why am I supposed to be empathetic? Every time I talk you complete ignore my point and go off on a tangent about something else entirely.

uuuMMM no you always read some section and take a word and go off with it some were. Never addressing my original argument to began with.

(September 11, 2015 at 3:32 pm)Losty Wrote: I said amputation for cosmetic purposes. I am talking about the same fucking thing as you and saying that it is not for medical reasons.

No you turn self amputation into self cosmic amputation. They are not the same thing at all, they are completely different.

(September 11, 2015 at 3:32 pm)Losty Wrote: Your reading comprehension sucks. I know it's not your fault but it makes it extremely difficult to have a conversation with you.

HaHa keep showing you lovely self condescending self-showing.

hey like I said dyslexia (it is a learning disability that affects both reading and writing skills, and for some math as well) its a bitch.

Oohh, so being off-topic is bad. Got it.

Okay, so someone refresh me, then.. WTF does any of this have to do with a Same-Sex Marriage ruling from SCotUS that found sexual orientation does not meet the strict scrutiny test, under the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th amendment, for a compelling government interest in prohibiting their access to the civil institution of marriage under state law?