(December 28, 2015 at 5:43 am)Stimbo Wrote: What happened to your truce, bud?

Those big, mean atheists forced him to behave in this unChristian manner! They held his head so tightly, he couldn't even turn the other cheek.

(December 28, 2015 at 6:49 am)robvalue Wrote: Faith and evidence are indicative of two entirely different modes of thinking, except when faith is conflated with justified confidence; which happens 976.3 times a day on average. If one has demonstrable evidence, there is no need for faith.

Remember, Delicate here doesn't understand the difference between knowledge and belief.

(December 28, 2015 at 1:11 pm)Nestor Wrote:

(December 28, 2015 at 9:17 am)LastPoet Wrote: The dark ages were caused by religion.

Um, no. The dark ages were not "caused" by "religion."

What were they caused by? It seems to me like he hit the nail on the head on that one.

(December 28, 2015 at 1:24 pm)excitedpenguin Wrote:

(December 28, 2015 at 1:11 pm)Nestor Wrote: Um, no. The dark ages were not "caused" by "religion."

What were they caused by? It seems to me like he hit the nail on the head on that one.

They were caused by the dissolution of the Roman Empire. The Church stepped into the power vacuum, but it did not create it. The Visigoths did.

(December 28, 2015 at 1:32 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(December 28, 2015 at 1:24 pm)excitedpenguin Wrote: What were they caused by? It seems to me like he hit the nail on the head on that one.

They were caused by the dissolution of the Roman Empire.  The Church stepped into the power vacuum, but it did not create it. The Visigoths did.

Can you not see how you're proving my point right now?

Just because there was a power vacuum, doesn't mean the outcome would've been the same no matter what replaced The Church. So the Dark Ages were, in fact, caused by religion - very much so.

(December 28, 2015 at 1:24 pm)excitedpenguin Wrote:

(December 28, 2015 at 1:11 pm)Nestor Wrote: Um, no. The dark ages were not "caused" by "religion."

What were they caused by? It seems to me like he hit the nail on the head on that one.

The dark ages were caused by the fall of the Roman Empire.

The time period was heavily exploited by religion though. People in general were in despair all across Europe, Asia, and Africa making them easy prey for Catholicism and Islam.

Just my .02

But we could very well blame religion for the fall of the Roman Empire, as well. I'm not saying religion is the only thing behind all of these changes, but it sure as hell is one of them.

(December 28, 2015 at 1:32 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(December 28, 2015 at 1:24 pm)excitedpenguin Wrote: What were they caused by? It seems to me like he hit the nail on the head on that one.

They were caused by the dissolution of the Roman Empire.  The Church stepped into the power vacuum, but it did not create it. The Visigoths did.

The romans had conquered their land... the poos Visigoths were just retaliating at a particularly vulnerable moment for the empire... The romans did it, first!

(December 28, 2015 at 1:24 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:

(December 28, 2015 at 6:49 am)robvalue Wrote: Faith and evidence are indicative of two entirely different modes of thinking, except when faith is conflated with justified confidence; which happens 976.3 times a day on average. If one has demonstrable evidence, there is no need for faith.

Remember, Delicate here doesn't understand the difference between knowledge and belief.

Really? Oh dear. Let's hope it can be one of the things he learns from us, eventually.

As for Frodo, I couldn't fathom what his beliefs actually were. He didn't seem to know himself, or else was being very coy.