CL. That last sentence is exactly what I've been thinking of for a while. Just been trying to decide how to word it.

Kudos.

(January 17, 2016 at 1:39 am)pool the great Wrote: Yeah, no shit Sherlock, of course staring is rude.
We are talking about women's clothes and how it is supposedly objectifying a women for looking at her when she dress sexy.

(January 17, 2016 at 1:53 am)pool the great Wrote:

(January 17, 2016 at 1:44 am)Homeless Nutter Wrote: Consciously suppressing sexuality, as well as many other natural instincts - at least to a certain extent - is what our civilization has been built upon.

If you see you mate's attractive girlfriend - do you shamelessly hit on her, risking social backlash?  Or do you - in fact - suppress your sexuality, for the sake of social norms and just beat off to her FB photo later?

I think we all know how our sexuality works - and that it needs to be controlled, or else we revert to behaving like a bunch of apes, fighting to death over the right to f*ck.

I agree with you that sexuality has to be controlled to an extend, but it is never okay to suppress sexuality. Never.
Shaming men for looking at women that dress sexy is suppressing sexuality which is sexist by all means, furthermore the supposedly claim that women are being objectified because of how men's sexuality work and therefore men should alter how their sexuality works is so sexist it's baffling.

(January 17, 2016 at 1:55 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote:

(January 17, 2016 at 1:45 am)pool the great Wrote: Whoever said women always dress sexy to impress guys?
Furthermore, I do not agreeing that it is objectifying to look at a women that dress sexy. It is how men are wired, it has nothing to do with objectifying. Men are attracted to how women look.

You are correct, men were wired to be sexually attracted to the way women look. Again, no one is saying otherwise. What we're saying is that staring at a girl you see out somewhere or whatever, is rude. Just as it is rude to stare at anyone. And in that sense, it does become objectifying because you are being disrespectful to her as a human being by continuously being rude enough to stare as though it were just some thing... and not a person who deserves more respect than to be treated rudely like that.

I've talked to my husband about this many times, and he says that when he sees a very pretty girl, he simply acknowledges and appreciates the fact that she's pretty, and then goes on about his day. He doesn't sit there and stare and start thinking dirty thoughts. It is entirely possible to just go on about your day and not get creepy.

(January 17, 2016 at 1:53 am)pool the great Wrote:

(January 17, 2016 at 1:44 am)Homeless Nutter Wrote: Consciously suppressing sexuality, as well as many other natural instincts - at least to a certain extent - is what our civilization has been built upon.

If you see you mate's attractive girlfriend - do you shamelessly hit on her, risking social backlash?  Or do you - in fact - suppress your sexuality, for the sake of social norms and just beat off to her FB photo later?

I think we all know how our sexuality works - and that it needs to be controlled, or else we revert to behaving like a bunch of apes, fighting to death over the right to f*ck.

I agree with you that sexuality has to be controlled to an extend, but it is never okay to suppress sexuality. Never.
Shaming men for looking at women that dress sexy is suppressing sexuality which is sexist by all means, furthermore the supposedly claim that women are being objectified because of how men's sexuality work and therefore men should alter how their sexuality works is so sexist it's baffling.

Hey man, don't put all men into the same category of being "wired" the same as you, I can assure you I am not wired like you. You act like we are all 10 year old boys seeing a pair of boobs for the first time.

(January 12, 2016 at 8:14 pm)TrueChristian Wrote: Why are they so skimpy these days? Is it proof that global warming is happening?

Or is it just a shift in our values, that unlike in olden days, society favors women who "bare it all" before a good and wholesome marriage?

I do fear the role models women have. Why is it that Taylor Swift, Lena Dunham and Miley Cyrus are models for todays ladies?

Why is this woman not a female role model or really revered at all anymore?  http://www.catholictradition.org/Litanies/litany37.jpg


Answers please!!

Easy

Checkmate again TC

(January 17, 2016 at 1:53 am)Mr.wizard Wrote:

(January 17, 2016 at 1:46 am)Heat Wrote: What do they dress sexy for other than to impress other people?


Why the fuck are they trying to impress themselves? Especially when they can't even see themselves unless standing in front of a mirror.

There's no logic to this statement, only scapegoating so you don't have to agree on a single point with someone in opposition to your position.


(They are trying to dress sexy for other people, not always the opposite gender, but to claim it's nothing to do with trying to impress others is a lie)

This is total Bullshit, women like to feel sexy and they like to wear things that make them feel sexy. Everyone likes to leave the house looking good it makes people feel good, its not always about trying to impress someone, its about self esteem.

Sexy ~ Attractive

[Attractive]Attraction

Why is someone trying to look attractive, without seeking attraction?
There is literally no point to that.
However, that's not the case.

(January 17, 2016 at 2:03 am)Heat Wrote:

(January 17, 2016 at 1:53 am)Mr.wizard Wrote: This is total Bullshit, women like to feel sexy and they like to wear things that make them feel sexy. Everyone likes to leave the house looking good it makes people feel good, its not always about trying to impress someone, its about self esteem.

Sexy ~ Attractive

[Attractive]Attraction

Why is someone trying to look attractive, without seeking attraction?
There is literally no point to that.
However, that's not the case.

Self esteem, makes them feel good about themselves, it's not about seeing how men will gawk at them.

(January 17, 2016 at 2:01 am)Mr.wizard Wrote:

(January 17, 2016 at 1:53 am)pool the great Wrote: I agree with you that sexuality has to be controlled to an extend, but it is never okay to suppress sexuality. Never.
Shaming men for looking at women that dress sexy is suppressing sexuality which is sexist by all means, furthermore the supposedly claim that women are being objectified because of how men's sexuality work and therefore men should alter how their sexuality works is so sexist it's baffling.

Hey man, don't put all men into the same category of being "wired" the same as you, I can assure you I am not wired like you. You act like we are all 10 year old boys seeing a pair of boobs for the first time.

Are you telling me you don't get a boner when you see a naked chick? I suppose you get a boner when she talks about her feelingz then. Good for you man.

(January 17, 2016 at 2:05 am)Mr.wizard Wrote:

(January 17, 2016 at 2:03 am)Heat Wrote: Sexy ~ Attractive

[Attractive]Attraction

Why is someone trying to look attractive, without seeking attraction?
There is literally no point to that.
However, that's not the case.

Self esteem, makes them feel good about themselves, it's not about seeing how men will gawk at them.

I get where you're coming from, you're arguing thinking about your wife in your mind, respect to her and to you man. Huge respect for you guys.
What you have to realize is this is not the same as the days you used to live in, this is the modern society where men have to fight for justice, equality and above all call out sexism when they see it.

(January 17, 2016 at 1:55 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote:

(January 17, 2016 at 1:45 am)pool the great Wrote: Whoever said women always dress sexy to impress guys?
Furthermore, I do not agreeing that it is objectifying to look at a women that dress sexy. It is how men are wired, it has nothing to do with objectifying. Men are attracted to how women look.

You are correct, men were wired to be sexually attracted to the way women look. Again, no one is saying otherwise. What we're saying is that staring at a girl you see out somewhere or whatever, is rude. Just as it is rude to stare at anyone. And in that sense, it does become objectifying because you are being disrespectful to her as a human being by continuously being rude enough to stare as though it were just some thing... and not a person who deserves more respect than to be treated rudely like that.

I've talked to my husband about this many times, and he says that when he sees a very pretty girl, he simply acknowledges and appreciates the fact that she's pretty, and then goes on about his day. He doesn't sit there and stare and start thinking dirty thoughts. It is entirely possible to just go on about your day and not get creepy.

Thinking dirty thoughts?

Why do you have this spectrum, that either you look quickly, or stare intensively and creepily thinking dirty things.

It's perfectly plausible most people will simply look longer than normal at a woman dressed skimpy, with minimal clothes, or that is simply attractive. If you want to call that "staring" be my guest, but that's not the point.

The point is that a person staring isn't causing you any harm or disrupting you unless you let them, if you are dressed attractively you have no reason to not expect people to look, and as well you have no reason to go confront this person about looking while clearly dressing for the purpose of being looked at, if you can simply move or ignore them if you are that upset. If they follow you, that's harassment. Don't jump to conclusions about a person looking longer than normal and think they are the most perverted piece of shit human being on the planet like you have just demonstrated CL, and by all means if you are wearing something for the purpose of appearing attractive don't go and blame them for taking notice.

(January 17, 2016 at 1:49 am)Heat Wrote:

(January 17, 2016 at 1:46 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Yep. 

Some men seem to think the world revolves around them. Truth is a lot of times women dress the way they do because it makes them feel good and confident, or they're big into fashion and that is how they express themselves. Believe it or not, it isn't all about you all the time.  

A woman dressing sexy is not an invitation (or an excuse) for a man to act like a disrespectful creep.

They want to express themselves, yet excuse me for acknowledging that?

There's a big difference between acknowledging it and going on about your day, and staring/acting creepy. The first is perfectly ok. The second is disrespectful.

Quote:Who the fuck are these women who have 0 self awareness of the world around them and the people in it?

Why would you want to feel confident in dressing minimalistic, if not for the purpose of flaunting your body? Yet HOW DARE ANYONE LOOK AT WHAT YOU'RE CLEARLY DOING.

These arguments are simply and utterly nonsensical.

When I was still single I used to wear really sexy, expensive underwear from Victoria's Secret. Only in my favorite colors - black, red, and hot pink. And yet... I was celibate and didn't strip down to my underwear in front of anyone. So, why did I wear them? Obviously no one was going to see them, and I knew that. I wore them because it made me feel sexy, for myself. 

Again, believe it or not, the existence of women doesn't revolve around men all the time. And neither should it.