(February 23, 2011 at 11:05 am)Watson Wrote: I like it when atheists try to tell me why and how my faith is the way it is. It's so adorable.

I like it when Christians try to deny facts. It's so.....pathetic.

(February 23, 2011 at 11:05 am)Watson Wrote: I like it when atheists try to tell me why and how my faith is the way it is. It's so adorable.

You desperately need the help.

(February 23, 2011 at 11:27 am)Strongbad Wrote:

(February 23, 2011 at 11:05 am)Watson Wrote: I like it when atheists try to tell me why and how my faith is the way it is. It's so adorable.

I like it when Christians try to deny facts. It's so.....pathetic.

Indeed.

Setting aside that one party to the contract doesn't exist (including his godhead buddies and alter egos of the holy spirit and the dead jewish guy), I would question the validity of the contract as it is made under duress. For those who could bring themselves to believe it, failure to enter into this contract would render those folks subject to enternal torture, condemned by a thing who apparently is just the best fucking super-super-magic-love-being ever. If I could bring myself to beleive this I would feel compelled to sign up because he could carry his threat out, and therefore be unable to freely enter jnto this contract. Can anyone ever freely turn to jayzus?

(February 23, 2011 at 11:21 am)theVOID Wrote: Bullshit, to earn salvation you need to accept a dead jewish zombie as your slave master. Good deeds are not enough, being ethical is not enough, if you deny the spirit you can not be saved - "But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin" - Mark 3:29

Bullshit yourself, VOID. You obviously didn't understand what was said. Salvation is bestowed, it is the acceptance of that salvation that is entirely dependent upon the person. Once you accept God, once you accept the Holy Spirit, once you truly believe in it you will see that it was there all the time; it was merely your unwillingness to see that blinded you. The haze is internal. The shadow is allowed in by choice.

What I am saying boils down to this; God is the one who bestows salvation upon a person, and once a person recognizes this they have come into their own salvation by choice. Aside from reiterating this over and over, I've already spoken my views on this forum many a time. So your asking me to tell you then is silly.

Quote:Good thing the holy spirit is a completely bullshit fairy tale, oh wait, I've committed an unforgivable sin, guess I'll be having a crispy afterlife...

It's called change, VOID. Geddit?

@Strongbad: And what facts would it be that I deny?

(February 23, 2011 at 1:09 pm)Watson Wrote: God is the one who bestows salvation upon a person,

Evidence required.

(February 23, 2011 at 1:42 pm)downbeatplumb Wrote:

(February 23, 2011 at 1:09 pm)Watson Wrote: God is the one who bestows salvation upon a person,

Evidence required.

But none will be forthcoming.

(February 23, 2011 at 1:09 pm)Watson Wrote:

(February 23, 2011 at 11:21 am)theVOID Wrote: Bullshit, to earn salvation you need to accept a dead jewish zombie as your slave master. Good deeds are not enough, being ethical is not enough, if you deny the spirit you can not be saved - "But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin" - Mark 3:29

Bullshit yourself, VOID. You obviously didn't understand what was said. Salvation is bestowed, it is the acceptance of that salvation that is entirely dependent upon the person. Once you accept God, once you accept the Holy Spirit, once you truly believe in it you will see that it was there all the time; it was merely your unwillingness to see that blinded you. The haze is internal. The shadow is allowed in by choice.

What I am saying boils down to this; God is the one who bestows salvation upon a person, and once a person recognizes this they have come into their own salvation by choice. Aside from reiterating this over and over, I've already spoken my views on this forum many a time. So your asking me to tell you then is silly.

Quote:Good thing the holy spirit is a completely bullshit fairy tale, oh wait, I've committed an unforgivable sin, guess I'll be having a crispy afterlife...

It's called change, VOID. Geddit?

@Strongbad: And what facts would it be that I deny?

And where did I try to tell you why and how your "faith" is the way it is?

What I did was point out that ALL Christians enter into a salvation contract with their God. You confirmed that it is indeed a contract when you stated "Once you accept God, once you accept the Holy Spirit, once you truly believe in it" i.e., as soon as you fulfill your obligations under the contract, then "Salvation is bestowed" i.e., God performs the benefit. What you have avoided is the contention that all Christians enter into the contract based upon hearsay.

@ Captain S - excellent point - the contract is entered under duress, under the threat of eternal damnation should one not agree to be bound by its terms.

(February 23, 2011 at 1:09 pm)Watson Wrote:

(February 23, 2011 at 11:21 am)theVOID Wrote: Bullshit, to earn salvation you need to accept a dead jewish zombie as your slave master. Good deeds are not enough, being ethical is not enough, if you deny the spirit you can not be saved - "But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin" - Mark 3:29

Bullshit yourself, VOID. You obviously didn't understand what was said. Salvation is bestowed, it is the acceptance of that salvation that is entirely dependent upon the person. Once you accept God, once you accept the Holy Spirit, once you truly believe in it you will see that it was there all the time; it was merely your unwillingness to see that blinded you. The haze is internal. The shadow is allowed in by choice.

1) That's exactly akin to saying "I bestow upon you this offering of strawberry, but you can't simply accept, you have to become my bitch first, if you don't accept my offer I'm going to boil your balls in hot oil"

2) That's both preaching AND bullshit. Firstly, if you're just going to winge on about how God is real and we have to accept it to see if you're not making an argument, you're wasting time. Secondly, that's the same as saying I believe x therefore x - It's no more legitimate than a Muslim saying "Once you accept Allah as the one true god you will see that Jesus isn't lord"

3) You cannot chose to believe, you have to be persuaded.

Quote:What I am saying boils down to this; God is the one who bestows salvation upon a person, and once a person recognizes this they have come into their own salvation by choice.

1) It's not a choice first and foremost, you have to believe it first.

2) Once you believe it the choice is a) Accept jewish zombie as my slave master, b) Burn in hell. \

Your deity is a complete thug.

Quote: Aside from reiterating this over and over, I've already spoken my views on this forum many a time. So your asking me to tell you then is silly.

Right, and like we've said, Faith is believing something for which you have absolutely no reason to.

Quote:It's called change, VOID. Geddit?

Change? Do you mean the church changed what parts of the bible they believe OR your god changed his mind? But he's atemporal, changing his mind requires two states of affairs minimum...

(February 23, 2011 at 11:05 am)Watson Wrote: I like it when atheists try to tell me why and how my faith is the way it is. It's so adorable.

You need to realise that many atheists are Ex Christians and have been there, done that, know how your religion works and discovered the total BS that is Christianity.

(February 23, 2011 at 1:09 pm)Watson Wrote: What I am saying boils down to this; God is the one who bestows salvation upon a person, and once a person recognizes this they have come into their own salvation by choice. Aside from reiterating this over and over, I've already spoken my views on this forum many a time. So your asking me to tell you then is silly.

God doesn't just go around bestowing salvation will-nilly. You have EARN it. If you didn't, then god would be handing it out to people randomly. Regardless of whether you think someone always has salvation they just need to find it, there are conditions that need to filled. Again, you have to earn it.

BTW, is it really someone's choice to be saved when they're told that if they aren't they will spend eternity burning in hell? We have a legal term for that called extortion.