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RE: Agnostic Skepticism- My Views
November 13, 2016 at 4:55 am
(This post was last modified: November 13, 2016 at 4:56 am by robvalue.)
You're not the first person we've had trying to make an issue out of language. Words have meanings. We just have to agree what they mean. Clearly, you use them differently to (most of) us. So direct comparisons are useless until we've agreed what definitions we use.
If you call your position "agnostic scepticism" or whatever, then I am the same as you, with regard to a generic creator. We're on the same floor, whatever you like to call it.
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RE: Agnostic Skepticism- My Views
November 13, 2016 at 4:59 am
(This post was last modified: November 13, 2016 at 4:59 am by robvalue.)
(November 13, 2016 at 4:53 am)RiddledWithFear Wrote: (November 13, 2016 at 4:47 am)robvalue Wrote: Okay. I expect you haven't read my article then, or watched my video. I won't repeat myself.
You are using language differently to us. That is all that is happening.
Yes, I have read your article, and have given my reasoning. Again, you're saying the same thing each post, and I've given my reasoning. Nevertheless, I can accept your reasoning. I do not wish to start a heated debate.
Fair enough.
Yes, I'm saying the same thing, because you're making the same mistake. Using different meanings for words to us, to try and point to a difference that isn't there. You can call your position elephant ears if you like, and I'm also elephant ears in that case. To us, we call it weak atheism.
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RE: Agnostic Skepticism- My Views
November 13, 2016 at 5:01 am
(November 13, 2016 at 4:54 am)Rhythm Wrote: It's not about leaning, there's nothing to lean -to-. Either you believe in gods or you don't. If you can't truthfully say "I believe in god/s"....then you simply don't believe. An agnostic atheist is a person who doesn't believe, and does not know. Sounds like you. You;re in good company, though, alot of agnostic atheists prefer to be called agnostics. It's okay, we know what you mean, lol.
I do not claim to believe. I have explained this. Neither do I claim to not believe. I claim to be neutral. I'm just as likely to attack a religious doctrine as I am to attack a scientific hypothesis. I'm just as likely to attack a cult as I am to attack a hate-filled, hell-bent on attacking religion, community. I am neutral. I do noy pick sides. Until we have solid evidence, I'm not taking sides.
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RE: Agnostic Skepticism- My Views
November 13, 2016 at 5:01 am
Do you remember that doc guy?
I tried to explain this to him endlessly but he just couldn't get it. He got so angry about it he quit the forum. Over a difference in definitions.
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RE: Agnostic Skepticism- My Views
November 13, 2016 at 5:02 am
Yes, we call not picking sides weak atheism. Clearly you don't. And that is fine.
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RE: Agnostic Skepticism- My Views
November 13, 2016 at 5:05 am
(November 13, 2016 at 4:59 am)robvalue Wrote: (November 13, 2016 at 4:53 am)RiddledWithFear Wrote: Yes, I have read your article, and have given my reasoning. Again, you're saying the same thing each post, and I've given my reasoning. Nevertheless, I can accept your reasoning. I do not wish to start a heated debate.
Fair enough.
Yes, I'm saying the same thing, because you're making the same mistake. Using different meanings for words to us, to try and point to a difference that isn't there. You can call your position elephant ears if you like, and I'm also elephant ears in that case. To us, we call it weak atheism.
Weak atheism, also sometimes referred to as implicit atheism, is simply another name for the broadest and most general conception of atheism: the absence of belief in any gods. A weak atheist is someone who lacks theism and who does not happen to believe in the existence of any gods no more, no less. This is also sometimes called atheism because most people who self-consciously lack belief in gods tend to do so for agnostic reasons.-http://atheism.about.com/od/atheismquestions/a/strong_weak.htm
I haven't claimed this. I claimed I'm neutral, and I don't claim to not believe, nor do I claim to believe. I'm neutral, because not believe is not the proper way to explain it. I have not stated that do not believe. I simply have not made a choice, because I find it illogical to do so.
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RE: Agnostic Skepticism- My Views
November 13, 2016 at 5:07 am
(November 13, 2016 at 5:02 am)robvalue Wrote: Yes, we call not picking sides weak atheism. Clearly you don't. And that is fine.
Fine, call it what you like. Nevertheless, as I've stated, I don't wish to start a heated debate.
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RE: Agnostic Skepticism- My Views
November 13, 2016 at 5:10 am
(This post was last modified: November 13, 2016 at 5:11 am by The Grand Nudger.)
(November 13, 2016 at 5:01 am)RiddledWithFear Wrote: I do not claim to believe. Which makes you an atheist. Pretty straightforward, since atheists are just people who do not believe.
Quote:I have explained this. Neither do I claim to not believe. I claim to be neutral.
Neutral isn't believing, so, again, an atheist, a person who does not believe. Bit of binary proposition, you know?
Quote:I'm just as likely to attack a religious doctrine as I am to attack a scientific hypothesis.
Nothing to do with atheism.
Quote:I'm just as likely to attack a cult as I am to attack a hate-filled, hell-bent on attacking religion, community.
Nothing to do with atheism.
Quote:I am neutral. I do noy pick sides. Until we have solid evidence, I'm not taking sides.
Solid evidence of -what-...lol? You don't need evidence for beliefs, ask the christers, lol. You;d need evidence for knowledge, perhaps...but that would be the agnostic/gnostic portion, not the atheist/theist portion. There are no "sides" McNubbins, the term only refers to your personal state of belief, not the accuracy of anyones personal state of belief, lol. You don't believe, therefore you're an atheist...a person who does not believe, even if you are -also- an agnostic, a person who does not know.
Hence, agnostic atheist.
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RE: Agnostic Skepticism- My Views
November 13, 2016 at 5:11 am
Okay... what is it you want to do then?
You've announced to us that you're the same as many of us, but you call it something different. Where do we go from there?
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RE: Agnostic Skepticism- My Views
November 13, 2016 at 5:15 am
(This post was last modified: November 13, 2016 at 5:16 am by robvalue.)
By the way, "atheist" is a description of fact, it's not a label one chooses. Of course, you can identify as anything you like, but either you actually are an atheist, or you are not. It refers to a real thing; a state of mind. The same thing goes for being a theist.
This is different to being a Christian. All you need to do to be a Christian is to say you're a Christian. What you actually believe is of no relevance. Christianity is a club of sorts; atheism is not.
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