Oh really.  So how come you aren't standing out in front of WalMart stoning the workers as they report for duty on the sabbath?

Your fucking god will be very disappointed in you.

Without a standard of morality, there is no way to judge what is good or bad. Atheists, for example, might decry what is the behavior of God in the Old Testament when he orders the destruction of people groups. But, by what standard does any atheist have to judge what is morally correct? At best, an atheist would only have the ability to express an opinion since he cannot offer any objective standard of morality.

I am not judging what is right and wrong. God does, and he has communicated his standard of righteousness. his communication is found in the Bible. Take the 10 Commandments in Exodus 20. We see a codification of moral standards. We are told not to lie, not to commit adultery, not to covet, etc.  These are standards given to us by God, and though there are other cultures that don't believe in the biblical God, they might have similar moral codes.  But, for the Christian, the Bible is the supreme authority that judges what is moral.

We can only judge what is moral if we have a standard given to us by God, not some standard that is based on emotion, opinion, or the changing morals of society.  Even though atheists, agnostics, Muslims, and non-Christians might not approve of standards found in the Scriptures, we Christians believe that the Bible is the revealed and inspired Word of God and that within its pages are the moral standards by which we are to model our behavior. Therefore, the right we have to judge what is moral comes from God as is revealed in his Word.

This is also from an article that I liked to be able to present to you as well.

Quote:Without a standard of morality, there is no way to judge what is good or bad.

Bullshit.

Killing people for working on the sabbath is BAD.  Killing people for most reasons is BAD.  You're fucking god is a piss poor example of that kind of morality.

(August 29, 2017 at 12:51 am)Minimalist Wrote:

(August 28, 2017 at 8:51 pm)Godisgood Wrote: A God with many faults. According to what standard are you using to judge that God is full of faults. And the verse about bashing infants against rocks doesnt mean what it says. There are websites available that explain it.

Mainly I use the standard of taking a look at his ersatz followers.  If assholes worship a god the god must be an asshole, too.

You don't even haveto do that in this case. Lets just pretend that god is real for a moment, and as described in the bible. One of his very first acts is punishing the whole of humanity for a situation he created where Adam and Eve could do naught but the act he punishes humanity for. Shortly thereafter he drowns the whole world because people acted in the exact way he crated them to act. Move on a few centuries and hes exhorting his followers to rape prepubescent girls. And his crowning glory? Pretenting to sacrifice himself to himself so that he can forgive humanity for the "sin" he forced Adam and Eve to commit.

By any objective measurement the Abrahamic god is evil.

(August 28, 2017 at 8:51 pm)Godisgood Wrote:

(February 19, 2012 at 7:10 pm)Ace Otana Wrote: It demonstrates just how malevolent and incompetent god is. A god with many faults is not worthy to be called 'god'. Just an irresponsible and evil being abusing his power. Not worthy of worship. Just as a mass murdering dictator isn't worthy of worship.

A God with many faults. According to what standard are you using to judge that God is full of faults. And the verse about bashing infants against rocks doesnt mean what it says. There are websites available that explain it.

 I've explained those verses to them many times and they just keep on bring them up. Even if they do listen they do not learn or care to learn, you will find some here who are going to show how little they care about truth.

GC

All religion is man made. All morality too ( especially the religious kind). Gods only know what their creators know, they act the way their creators act.

(August 30, 2017 at 2:53 am)Godscreated Wrote: I've explained those verses to them many times and they just keep on bring them up. Even if they do listen they do not learn or care to learn, you will find some here who are going to show how little they care about truth.

Yes, we've noticed.

(August 30, 2017 at 2:53 am)Godscreated Wrote:

(August 28, 2017 at 8:51 pm)Godisgood Wrote: A God with many faults. According to what standard are you using to judge that God is full of faults. And the verse about bashing infants against rocks doesnt mean what it says. There are websites available that explain it.

 I've explained those verses to them many times and they just keep on bring them up. Even if they do listen they do not learn or care to learn, you will find some here who are going to show how little they care about truth.

GC

Or maybe we just don't buy your explanations.  It's revealing how to you "learn" means believe what I tell you, and "truth" means whatever you believe.

---

(August 30, 2017 at 2:13 am)Godisgood Wrote: Without a standard of morality, there is no way to judge what is good or bad. Atheists, for example, might decry what is the behavior of God in the Old Testament when he orders the destruction of people groups. But, by what standard does any atheist have to judge what is morally correct? At best, an atheist would only have the ability to express an opinion since he cannot offer any objective standard of morality.

I am not judging what is right and wrong. God does, and he has communicated his standard of righteousness. his communication is found in the Bible. Take the 10 Commandments in Exodus 20. We see a codification of moral standards. We are told not to lie, not to commit adultery, not to covet, etc.  These are standards given to us by God, and though there are other cultures that don't believe in the biblical God, they might have similar moral codes.  But, for the Christian, the Bible is the supreme authority that judges what is moral.

We can only judge what is moral if we have a standard given to us by God, not some standard that is based on emotion, opinion, or the changing morals of society.  Even though atheists, agnostics, Muslims, and non-Christians might not approve of standards found in the Scriptures, we Christians believe that the Bible is the revealed and inspired Word of God and that within its pages are the moral standards by which we are to model our behavior. Therefore, the right we have to judge what is moral comes from God as is revealed in his Word.

This is also from an article that I liked to be able to present to you as well.

Morality IS based on the opinions and emotions, and frequently changes.  The interpretations of your god's morality has quite a bit over the years.

(August 30, 2017 at 2:13 am)Godisgood Wrote: Without a standard of morality, there is no way to judge what is good or bad. Atheists, for example, might decry what is the behavior of God in the Old Testament when he orders the destruction of people groups. But, by what standard does any atheist have to judge what is morally correct? At best, an atheist would only have the ability to express an opinion since he cannot offer any objective standard of morality.

OFC an atheist can offer an objective standard of morality.  I do it all the time.  It's by that standard I deem your "god" to be objectively immoral.  More accurately, I deem you and your fellow believers objectively immoral and "god" a simple outgrowth of your own damaged psyches' need to excuse it's immorality..

Quote:I am not judging what is right and wrong. God does, and he has communicated his standard of righteousness. his communication is found in the Bible. Take the 10 Commandments in Exodus 20. We see a codification of moral standards. We are told not to lie, not to commit adultery, not to covet, etc.  These are standards given to us by God, and though there are other cultures that don't believe in the biblical God, they might have similar moral codes.  But, for the Christian, the Bible is the supreme authority that judges what is moral.

"He can't be immoral, he makes the rules!" Even here...even in moral judgement, you fob off responsibility for your judgements to a third party. Is there -anything- that a christian will own their responsibility for?

Quote:We can only judge what is moral if we have a standard given to us by God, not some standard that is based on emotion, opinion, or the changing morals of society.  Even though atheists, agnostics, Muslims, and non-Christians might not approve of standards found in the Scriptures, we Christians believe that the Bible is the revealed and inspired Word of God and that within its pages are the moral standards by which we are to model our behavior. Therefore, the right we have to judge what is moral comes from God as is revealed in his Word.

You don't even -have- moral standards, you have an immorality excusing scheme based on the might of the abuser and the reward he offers sycophants.

I have to agree with GC on the meaning of the passage. It isn't an order to kill babies, it doesn't say you should dash babies against rocks. It's a lamentation, the psalmist is in such despair that the thought of their Babylonian captors suffering horrible fates is what he wants to sing about, and maybe it's also a prayer that the Babylonians be overthrown, or a prophecy that they will be.

It's a story of the response some Babylonians got when they demanded the psalmist sing for them.

1 By the rivers of Babylon,
there we sat and we wept
as we remembered Zion.
2 On the poplars within her we hung our lyres,
3 for it was there our captors asked us for words of song,
and our tormentors – for their amusement –
said, “Sing for us from a song of Zion.”
4 How can we sing a song of the Lord on foreign soil?
5 O Jerusalem, if I should forget you may my right hand wither.
6 May my tongue cleave to my palate
if I cease to remember you,
if I do not cause Jerusalem to be raised
to the very top of my joy.
7 Do you remember, O Lord, the Edomites on
the day of Jerusalem?
How they said, “Tear her down!
Down to her very foundation!”
8 O, Daughter of Babylon, you despoiler,
Happy is the one who pays you your recompense
as you dealt out to us.
9 Happy the one who will seize and dash your infants against the rock!