(December 11, 2017 at 6:41 pm)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: First off, there are two forms of value.  The first type would be the type of value that materialistic things have such as looking at a fancy television or having a fancy shaver.  This type of value, although it is something that can be cherished and appreciated, is virtually nothing in comparison to the higher value that a loved one would have in your life such as your mother.  Your mother is something so much more than just some fancy shaver or television.  But if we as human beings are nothing more than biological machines who have only this one life to live, then that reduces us to nothing more than materialistic things.  Since we are truly insignificant and nothing special in this universe which is something that is often said by skeptics such as the likes of Lawrence Krauss, then this means that the type of value we as human beings have would be reduced to nothing more than the type of value that materialistic things have.  We would be nothing more than insignificant biological machines and that is the lesser value we would have.  There is nothing warranting a higher value attributed to us as human beings if we are just biological machines living this one and only life.  The way I see it, the only thing that can bestow us this higher value would be the very notion of us being special in this universe.  That is, us being eternal souls who get to live on in the afterlife where we greet deceased loved ones, live happy forever after, etc.  If we are just biological machines living this one and only life, then we instead have every reason to treat our family and other people in this world as insignificant, materialistic things such as a shaver, book, bike, computer, etc.

My life might not mean anything to you but it does to this biological machine. I am sorry you feel that way.

(December 11, 2017 at 6:41 pm)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: First off, there are two forms of value.  The first type would be the type of value that materialistic things have such as looking at a fancy television or having a fancy shaver.  This type of value, although it is something that can be cherished and appreciated, is virtually nothing in comparison to the higher value that a loved one would have in your life such as your mother.  Your mother is something so much more than just some fancy shaver or television.  But if we as human beings are nothing more than biological machines who have only this one life to live, then that reduces us to nothing more than materialistic things.  Since we are truly insignificant and nothing special in this universe which is something that is often said by skeptics such as the likes of Lawrence Krauss, then this means that the type of value we as human beings have would be reduced to nothing more than the type of value that materialistic things have.  We would be nothing more than insignificant biological machines and that is the lesser value we would have.  There is nothing warranting a higher value attributed to us as human beings if we are just biological machines living this one and only life.  The way I see it, the only thing that can bestow us this higher value would be the very notion of us being special in this universe.  That is, us being eternal souls who get to live on in the afterlife where we greet deceased loved ones, live happy forever after, etc.  If we are just biological machines living this one and only life, then we instead have every reason to treat our family and other people in this world as insignificant, materialistic things such as a shaver, book, bike, computer, etc.

Only having one finite existence makes something more valuable. Not less. Value is dictated by rarity, after all. Yes some things have more value than others, like your one mother over a replaceable shaver. What value to we gain from having an eternal existence. I'd argue that this life means nothing, if we're going to become eternal spirits after this. Life is short, therefor it has value. If you live for eighty years on this world, what difference will is make eighty thousand years from now when you're in the next life?

The thing that you think gives us value, I argue takes away from it. Because something that lasts forever isn't valuable. Something being finite and rare is what gives it value.

Depends on the individual and what you intend to use them for.

Strong male slaves for constructions are inherently more valuable than other slaves for the same task, but have a lower inherent values as sex slaves.

And, despite claims to the contrary, any living human has value when used as a sacrifice to the Dark One.

(December 11, 2017 at 8:25 pm)Chad32 Wrote:

(December 11, 2017 at 6:41 pm)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: First off, there are two forms of value.  The first type would be the type of value that materialistic things have such as looking at a fancy television or having a fancy shaver.  This type of value, although it is something that can be cherished and appreciated, is virtually nothing in comparison to the higher value that a loved one would have in your life such as your mother.  Your mother is something so much more than just some fancy shaver or television.  But if we as human beings are nothing more than biological machines who have only this one life to live, then that reduces us to nothing more than materialistic things.  Since we are truly insignificant and nothing special in this universe which is something that is often said by skeptics such as the likes of Lawrence Krauss, then this means that the type of value we as human beings have would be reduced to nothing more than the type of value that materialistic things have.  We would be nothing more than insignificant biological machines and that is the lesser value we would have.  There is nothing warranting a higher value attributed to us as human beings if we are just biological machines living this one and only life.  The way I see it, the only thing that can bestow us this higher value would be the very notion of us being special in this universe.  That is, us being eternal souls who get to live on in the afterlife where we greet deceased loved ones, live happy forever after, etc.  If we are just biological machines living this one and only life, then we instead have every reason to treat our family and other people in this world as insignificant, materialistic things such as a shaver, book, bike, computer, etc.

Only having one finite existence makes something more valuable. Not less. Value is dictated by rarity, after all. Yes some things have more value than others, like your one mother over a replaceable shaver. What value to we gain from having an eternal existence. I'd argue that this life means nothing, if we're going to become eternal spirits after this. Life is short, therefor it has value. If you live for eighty years on this world, what difference will is make eighty thousand years from now when you're in the next life?

The thing that you think gives us value, I argue takes away from it. Because something that lasts forever isn't valuable. Something being finite and rare is what gives it value.

The thing is, the average human lifespan is nowhere near enough time for me.  As long as I am happy, having fun, and enjoying my life, then I would want to live like that for perhaps trillions of years or maybe even forever.  But as long as I have to live a life of depression, misery, and unhappiness, then that is no way to live for me and it is a life of no value.  The fact of the matter is, if I grew tired of living a happy and fun life after 60 or so years, then I would find much value and worth in this life being finite.  But I don't grow tired of a happy, fun life and the fact that this life isn't a happy life that lasts for perhaps trillions of years means that it isn't as valuable of a life to me.

(December 11, 2017 at 9:23 pm)Transcended Dimensions Wrote:

(December 11, 2017 at 8:25 pm)Chad32 Wrote: Only having one finite existence makes something more valuable. Not less. Value is dictated by rarity, after all. Yes some things have more value than others, like your one mother over a replaceable shaver. What value to we gain from having an eternal existence. I'd argue that this life means nothing, if we're going to become eternal spirits after this. Life is short, therefor it has value. If you live for eighty years on this world, what difference will is make eighty thousand years from now when you're in the next life?

The thing that you think gives us value, I argue takes away from it. Because something that lasts forever isn't valuable. Something being finite and rare is what gives it value.

The thing is, the average human lifespan is nowhere near enough time for me.  As long as I am happy, having fun, and enjoying my life, then I would want to live like that for perhaps trillions of years or maybe even forever.  But as long as I have to live a life of depression, misery, and unhappiness, then that is no way to live for me and it is a life of no value.  The fact of the matter is, if I grew tired of living a happy and fun life after 60 or so years, then I would find much value and worth in this life being finite.  But I don't grow tired of a happy, fun life and the fact that this life isn't a happy life that lasts for perhaps trillions of years means that it isn't as valuable of a life to me.

Good. Maybe your life is worth more to me to end than it is worth to you to continue for a few more worthless years. Are you game?

I think you are forgetting a little detail.

We think, and feel. Machines dont (for now).

In this vast universe, where almost everything is inert, we are not. I think that makes us special, even if it is for a limited time.

(December 11, 2017 at 9:23 pm)Transcended Dimensions Wrote:

(December 11, 2017 at 8:25 pm)Chad32 Wrote: Only having one finite existence makes something more valuable. Not less. Value is dictated by rarity, after all. Yes some things have more value than others, like your one mother over a replaceable shaver. What value to we gain from having an eternal existence. I'd argue that this life means nothing, if we're going to become eternal spirits after this. Life is short, therefor it has value. If you live for eighty years on this world, what difference will is make eighty thousand years from now when you're in the next life?

The thing that you think gives us value, I argue takes away from it. Because something that lasts forever isn't valuable. Something being finite and rare is what gives it value.

The thing is, the average human lifespan is nowhere near enough time for me.  As long as I am happy, having fun, and enjoying my life, then I would want to live like that for perhaps trillions of years or maybe even forever.  But as long as I have to live a life of depression, misery, and unhappiness, then that is no way to live for me and it is a life of no value.  The fact of the matter is, if I grew tired of living a happy and fun life after 60 or so years, then I would find much value and worth in this life being finite.  But I don't grow tired of a happy, fun life and the fact that this life isn't a happy life that lasts for perhaps trillions of years means that it isn't as valuable of a life to me.

One problem with infinity is, you will eventually do everything that anyone could ever think of doing, more times than you can count. And while 80+ years may not be enough for you, that's all the more reason to live life to the fullest. That doesn't make life lose its value. It makes every second even more valuable.

(December 11, 2017 at 9:54 pm)Macoleco Wrote: I think you are forgetting a little detail.

We think, and feel. Machines dont (for now).

In this vast universe, where almost everything is inert, we are not. I think that makes us special, even if it is for a limited time.

We might be the only thing in the Universe that can fantasize about alternate realities and spooky gods. Amazing!

1. Humans are not machines were being 

2. Just because life does not reach the span your prefer . Does not make it valueless 

3. What is gained by living forever?

---

(December 11, 2017 at 10:02 pm)chimp3 Wrote:

(December 11, 2017 at 9:54 pm)Macoleco Wrote: I think you are forgetting a little detail.

We think, and feel. Machines dont (for now).

In this vast universe, where almost everything is inert, we are not. I think that makes us special, even if it is for a limited time.

We might be the only thing in the Universe that can fantasize about alternate realities and spooky gods. Amazing!

Yeah most animals i imagine are to smart for religion

(December 11, 2017 at 9:59 pm)Chad32 Wrote:

(December 11, 2017 at 9:23 pm)Transcended Dimensions Wrote: The thing is, the average human lifespan is nowhere near enough time for me.  As long as I am happy, having fun, and enjoying my life, then I would want to live like that for perhaps trillions of years or maybe even forever.  But as long as I have to live a life of depression, misery, and unhappiness, then that is no way to live for me and it is a life of no value.  The fact of the matter is, if I grew tired of living a happy and fun life after 60 or so years, then I would find much value and worth in this life being finite.  But I don't grow tired of a happy, fun life and the fact that this life isn't a happy life that lasts for perhaps trillions of years means that it isn't as valuable of a life to me.

One problem with infinity is, you will eventually do everything that anyone could ever think of doing, more times than you can count. And while 80+ years may not be enough for you, that's all the more reason to live life to the fullest. That doesn't make life lose its value. It makes every second even more valuable.

Understood.  But it doesn't matter if I was doing the same things over and over again and revisiting the same places over and over again.  As long as I feel positive emotions from these things, then my life will always be good and beautiful.  It will never get old.  The only way it would get old would be if I felt negative emotions such as boredom and despair or if I felt apathy.