(May 12, 2009 at 2:13 pm)Kyuuketsuki Wrote:

(May 9, 2009 at 5:03 am)Darwinian Wrote: My first impression is that it seems quite neat and tidy but my first stumbling block is, how on earth do you install things.

TADA!!!!!!!!

And in one line you sum up my biggest dislike about Linux (and trust me, I'm fascinated by the bloody thing). You install a program and you can't find the bloody shortcut to run it, or you have to start hacking at files to make it run or you get into dependency hell. And that's after you get round the daunting task of getting presented with an OS which has everything, many of which are not quite consistent in terms of function or interface, many illogically spread across several applications where they should be in one (and no, I'm not saying windows is perfect but it is more consitent IMO) ... in short, despite the fact that I do appear to a fair bit about it, I just don't "get" Linux. It's a shame because if I could make the switch to it I probably would.

Kyu

Have you ever worked with deb files or Synaptic? Because I really have never had to do anything you just described above, ever. Applications install, dependencies are marked and downloaded automatically, and links are created in the finder above (in Ubuntu's case, in Kubuntu down below).

Apt is the debian tool.
SELInux is the rule set.

You can use chmod, chown, or umask- needs to be installed for tweaking.

Ubuntu is not a good choice no matter who says what. Sudo itself is a security risk.

You could have edited the Xorg configuration to accept a driver. Vi is wonderful.
Ubuntu is no more an operating system than the Debian it is based on.
Linux is a kernel only. Debian user are a bit anal about saying Linux/GNU or GNU/Linux but it is clearly the most reflective and true definition of the system.


Skype? Wow. That is not a good choice. Try ekiga, kphone, or some other native app.

It isn't "hacking," it's "text editing" and that is how all Nix systems should be able to run. By simply editing a text file including binaries.

The mailing lists are more informative followed by forums followed by local meetings followed then by google.

You cannot make a true custom build if you depend upon a package manager.

(June 3, 2009 at 5:18 am)moleque Wrote: Ubuntu is not a good choice no matter who says what. Sudo itself is a security risk.
*snip*
Skype? Wow. That is not a good choice. Try ekiga, kphone, or some other native app.

Choice is good. In your opinion some choices can be better than others but its still just opinion and is therefore not absolute. Ubuntu is a fine choice. I'd never choose it myself however, this has nothing to do with the operating system. Also, sudo is only a security risk if its malconfigured.
Like it or not, skype is a very popular VoIP program and it if your circle of friends use it exclusively then it probably isn't viable to switch.

(June 3, 2009 at 5:18 am)moleque Wrote: You cannot make a true custom build if you depend upon a package manager.

Given the general tone of the posts in this topic, do you really think building a fully custom built set up is within the immediate capacity of the op?

(June 3, 2009 at 5:18 am)moleque Wrote: Apt is the debian tool.
SELInux is the rule set.

You can use chmod, chown, or umask- needs to be installed for tweaking.

Ubuntu is not a good choice no matter who says what. Sudo itself is a security risk.

You could have edited the Xorg configuration to accept a driver. Vi is wonderful.

Darwinian, please ignore his post. You are starting out with Linux, there is no need to know how to use any of these commands if you are a beginner. I often find people are scared away from Ubuntu when they ought not be, because someone used some UNIX terms that they don't explain.

(May 12, 2009 at 2:43 pm)leo-rcc Wrote: Have you ever worked with deb files or Synaptic? Because I really have never had to do anything you just described above, ever. Applications install, dependencies are marked and downloaded automatically, and links are created in the finder above (in Ubuntu's case, in Kubuntu down below).

I've worked with lots of different Linux installation systems including Apt, Portage, RPM, TGZ and YaST ... the bets of them is YaST and even that is deeply flawed.

I will try deb/Synaptic next time I build a Linux system which will be soon because my new ESX server is ready all bar the data shifting needed to get my desired choices of disks in the system) ... 1.4TB of storage space? Won't that be fun

Kyu

How is apt not good? Synaptic is a graphical manager for apt you do realise...

(June 4, 2009 at 7:36 am)Tiberius Wrote: How is apt not good? Synaptic is a graphical manager for apt you do realise...

Adrian ... read what I said NOT what you think I said!

I said ****APT**** ... in other words the command line version! I've never used Synaptic in my life, I am prepared to give it a go and I stick to what I said.

Kyu

Here is why the confusion occured:

APT is the package manager.

"apt-get" is the command line application.

"Synaptic" is the GUI for the command line application (In other words it gives a Graphical User Interface to the apt-get command).

I was reading what you said; what you said just made no sense.

(June 4, 2009 at 2:57 pm)Tiberius Wrote: I was reading what you said; what you said just made no sense.

And if you'd followed the conversation you'd realize that what I said DID make sense because apt (which obviously includes apt-get and the rest of the associated suite of commands) CAN be used alone as an installation mechanism.

Kyu

(June 4, 2009 at 3:05 pm)Kyuuketsuki Wrote: And if you'd followed the conversation you'd realize that what I said DID make sense because apt (which obviously includes apt-get and the rest of the associated suite of commands) CAN be used alone as an installation mechanism.

Kyu

Irrelevant, and you are just being argumentative now.

Apt is a package managing tool. It has several interfaces, apt-get and Synaptic are both examples of these interfaces.

When you say "apt" rather than "apt-get" I (as a user of APT myself) assume you are talking about the package manager, especially since you list a load of package managers afterwards. For instance, you included Portage in the list, yet Portage is the package manager, and "emerge" is the command that you use to install stuff.

I simply assumed you meant the package manager, as any Linux user would.