I love Melbourne, not that I have been there, but many of my old friends emanate from that neck of the woods, But that is not half of it, the best add ever encouraging train use-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qMykLW4AXs

Welcome and we'll crack a tube of VB.

(November 24, 2012 at 5:54 pm)worldslaziestbusker Wrote: I am specifically keen to get government funded religious programs and staff out of our publicly funded schools, but you can say no to anyone who requests anything of you that you are not obliged to provide, too.
Could you please provide details of the many incidents you allude to? I am keen to follow up on this and see if the principal is applying preference to your church or if some other form of cronyism is at play.
Cheers
Matt

To clarify when I said "not isolated" I meant in general among churches and schools. I know of some successful chaplaincy programs here in Canberra in government schools that my own Church isn't a part of. You're happy to receive all the stuff that we Anglicans give you outside of schools, BTW, so I don't see where the problem lies. I actually don't agree at all with making religion a part of the curriculum, even in Christian schools. I had an argument over this with a youth leader once. I don't mind the idea of optional Christian classes, but I don't like the idea of it being a part of the curriculum.

Welcome! : D

Welcome aboard! We seem to be in danger of being overrun by Ozzies... not that I mind in the slightest; Australia is probably my favourite part of the globe. I welcome our Antipodean overlords!

Quote:To clarify when I said "not isolated" I meant in general among churches and schools. I know of some successful chaplaincy programs here in Canberra in government schools that my own Church isn't a part of. You're happy to receive all the stuff that we Anglicans give you outside of schools, BTW, so I don't see where the problem lies. I actually don't agree at all with making religion a part of the curriculum, even in Christian schools. I had an argument over this with a youth leader once. I don't mind the idea of optional Christian classes, but I don't like the idea of it being a part of the curriculum.

Please don't presume to tell me what I am and am not happy about. That so much land was ceded to the churches early in the colonisation of this continent gives them tremendous financial clout. The ongoing tax exemptions allow them a competitive advantage in any field they choose to have a stake, and that their books are not open for auditing means we can never know how well the services the government does allow them to provide are being provided. Don't mistake past errors in governance for necessity. Hospitals and schools can be run without Christian input just the same as roads can be built and sewers kept operating without help from churches.
Again, don't presume to tell me what I think. It's one of the two big problems I have with theists generally, the other being trying to tell me what to think.
"You atheists all think X. Really, you should think Y."
I think you should leave people outside your religion alone and let them get on with their lives. Is that statement of what I actually think clear enough for you, or do we need to discuss this further?

As to your anecdotes regarding requests made of your church and others:
If you won't provide evidence for your claims I am happy to ignore them, much the same as is the case for your deity.

(November 24, 2012 at 5:54 pm)worldslaziestbusker Wrote:

(November 24, 2012 at 1:10 pm)Lion IRC Wrote: Hey WLB,
Welcome. LTNS
This is a good forum.
Cheers.

Hello LionIRC
Why do you think this is a good forum?

---

More freedom of speech. Thats refreshing.
Talk Rational has freedom of speech too, but people stay on topic here more.

The ignore function makes it harder for someone/anyone to complain about ''having to'' put up with...blah blah blah ---> insert favorite reason for wanting someone banned here<---

(November 25, 2012 at 4:12 am)Lion IRC Wrote:

(November 24, 2012 at 5:54 pm)worldslaziestbusker Wrote: Hello LionIRC
Why do you think this is a good forum?

---

More freedom of speech. Thats refreshing.
Talk Rational has freedom of speech too, but people stay on topic here more.

The ignore function makes it harder for someone/anyone to complain about ''having to'' put up with...blah blah blah ---> insert favorite reason for wanting someone banned here<---

Freedom of speech is binary. You either have it or you don't. You can't have more freedom of speech in one place than in another, but identifying this category error in your thinking is tangential to the issues you've had at other sites. You had a fair go at AFA forums and you chose to chuck it by breaking the rules till you got banned, even goading the moderators to ban you. How does this compare with my treatment at Reasonable Faith Forums, where I was regularly censured for trying to get you to answer a question and was banned without notice or reason. What you think is a good forum and what I think is a good forum are clearly very different.
That you have not yet been banned here for evading questions and passive aggressive sledging suggests either that this forum is a poor match for my needs or that you have changed your posting ways considerably.
Free speech allows you to say what you like, but the price of free speech is dealing with the consequences of saying what you like. In my experience you are good at the first part but have trouble with the second part.
Ignoring something is a form of failure. Ignoring a problem doesn't deal with it or make it go away. Dealing with it or making it go away deals with it or makes it go away. People just ignoring a problem is the exact opposite of the reason I turn up on social justice forums trying to promote a change in the degree to which religions interfere in my life. Ignore is a coward's solution. Have the gumption to engage with or the guts to distance yourself from the people you disagree vehemently with.

Hi Matt... from sunny Perth Western Australia (I'm from Sydney and Zen is from Melbourne)

GO FOR IT!!

(November 25, 2012 at 5:04 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: Hi Matt... from sunny Perth Western Australia (I'm from Sydney and Zen is from Melbourne)

GO FOR IT!!

Been a while, KichigaiNeko. Not seen much of the Badger since we asked challenging questions at Australian Christian Forums together.

(November 25, 2012 at 5:22 am)worldslaziestbusker Wrote:

(November 25, 2012 at 5:04 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: Hi Matt... from sunny Perth Western Australia (I'm from Sydney and Zen is from Melbourne)

GO FOR IT!!

Been a while, KichigaiNeko. Not seen much of the Badger since we asked challenging questions at Australian Christian Forums together.

Really?? Oh my!

Well he is a bit indisposed atm....getting married at the end of this week so what with all the "Bucks" carryings on you can imagine

Will let him know when, ...when he wakes up!

good to see you on this site...