(May 21, 2013 at 5:19 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

(May 20, 2013 at 6:45 pm)ThomM Wrote: Today - 1600 children too young to even be responsible for their own actions will be sexually molested by a family member on earth - and every day forward. IF a god is all knowing - and all seeing - and Almighty - it knows - sees - and supposedly has the power to prevent that.

Sure god could prevent it, and those child molesters will receive justice. From an atheistic perspective you cannot even defend the claim that these child molesters did anything morally wrong, and those who are never caught will never receive justice for their actions. Give me the reality where they are all doing evil and will receive justice for their actions whether other people know about these actions or not.

(emphasis mine)

Wow, you really are an apologetic disgusting asshole, aren'tcha?

And you're gonna pretend that, by implication, that after people die they're gonna receive justice? No, by then it's over and done with and whatever actions they did will echo through the lives they affected. This is a far cry from justice, because it's your fucking Abrahamic religion that protects them in the first place. Ya dig?

(May 21, 2013 at 5:37 pm)Sal Wrote: Wow, you really are an apologetic disgusting asshole, aren'tcha?

And you're gonna pretend that, by implication, that after people die they're gonna receive justice? No, by then it's over and done with and whatever actions they did will echo through the lives they affected. This is a far cry from justice, because it's your fucking Abrahamic religion that protects them in the first place. Ya dig?

Don't fret, Sal. Just remember that every time you hear something like "from an atheistic perspective you cannot even defend the claim that these child molesters did anything morally wrong" what they're really saying is "if it wasn't for my belief that god was watching over my shoulder, I would be out molesting children right now."

FNM you full well know that's a straw man.

So I guess I'm defective then. I never feel the urge to fuck a toddler, despite god designing me to do so. Maybe I shouldn't criticize your gods mistakes and cock-ups so much - at least that gives it the opportunity to get something right by accident - since it's clearly incapable of getting anything right on purpose.

(May 21, 2013 at 7:50 pm)ChadWooters Wrote: FNM you full well know that's a straw man.

I know...I know. Forgive me ,oh Chad.

I was just pissing around and realized quite a while later that I should have put a smiley in that post to indicate that.

I just get frustrated hearing all of this "as an atheist you can't prove something is immoral" crap, as if it is impossible to determine what you should and sh

(May 21, 2013 at 5:37 pm)Sal Wrote:

(May 21, 2013 at 5:19 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote: Sure god could prevent it, and those child molesters will receive justice. From an atheistic perspective you cannot even defend the claim that these child molesters did anything morally wrong, and those who are never caught will never receive justice for their actions. Give me the reality where they are all doing evil and will receive justice for their actions whether other people know about these actions or not.

Wow, you really are an apologetic disgusting asshole, aren'tcha?

No need for name calling sir.

Quote: And you're gonna pretend that, by implication, that after people die they're gonna receive justice? No, by then it's over and done with and whatever actions they did will echo through the lives they affected.

No pretending required, Joseph Stalin is receiving justice as we speak for murdering 50 million of his fellow countryman. If God didn’t exist then he got off Scot free and died one of the most powerful men in the World. I take comfort in knowing justice was served.

Quote: This is a far cry from justice, because it's your fucking Abrahamic religion that protects them in the first place. Ya dig?

No, I don’t “dig”, that doesn’t make a wink of sense.

(May 21, 2013 at 7:50 pm)Faith No More Wrote: Don't fret, Sal. Just remember that every time you hear something like "from an atheistic perspective you cannot even defend the claim that these child molesters did anything morally wrong" what they're really saying is "if it wasn't for my belief that god was watching over my shoulder, I would be out molesting children right now."

You’re usually a bit more eloquent than this FNM. No, it God didn’t exist neither of us would be here right now.

(May 22, 2013 at 8:49 am)Rhythm Wrote: So I guess I'm defective then. I never feel the urge to fuck a toddler, despite god designing me to do so. Maybe I shouldn't criticize your gods mistakes and cock-ups so much - at least that gives it the opportunity to get something right by accident - since it's clearly incapable of getting anything right on purpose.

No, God’s upholding grace prevents all of us from being as evil as we could be, we do not deserve any credit for not committing such evil acts. How are you defining “right” here?

(May 22, 2013 at 8:53 am)Faith No More Wrote: I just get frustrated hearing all of this "as an atheist you can't prove something is immoral" crap, as if it is impossible to determine what you should and sh

There’s no need to get frustrated, if you believe my statement is wrong then just prove it. Provide a logically sound syllogism that proves child molestation would be wrong independent of time and place in a Universe devoid of God’s existence. If it’s sound I’ll admit I was wrong.

(May 22, 2013 at 2:24 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote: There’s no need to get frustrated, if you believe my statement is wrong then just prove it. Provide a logically sound syllogism that proves child molestation would be wrong independent of time and place in a Universe devoid of God’s existence. If it’s sound I’ll admit I was wrong.

Nice try, but you're the one that put forth the positive claim. You must show that without god it is impossible to prove it wrong, otherwise we can all just assume you are wrong.

(May 22, 2013 at 2:24 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote: No pretending required, Joseph Stalin is receiving justice as we speak for murdering 50 million of his fellow countryman. If God didn’t exist then he got off Scot free and died one of the most powerful men in the World. I take comfort in knowing justice was served.

I would consider it a small comfort if he was enduring punishment for his crimes, since I would rather that he had not been allowed to carry out such acts in the first place. Leaving us to our own devices, only to reward or punish us after the end, strikes me as unsatisfying.

When I think of the ones whose time on Earth was cut short quickly and brutally, I wonder if their time here had any value? At the least, those who are granted the gift of a heavenly afterlife may not have gotten any chance at enjoying their time in the flesh. Do you feel that hey get another shot at it somehow, or was that short and bitter existence all they were granted, and they are probably better off just forgetting it as they delight in their heavenly reward? It seems pointless to me to have that happen to them.

(May 22, 2013 at 2:29 pm)Faith No More Wrote: Nice try, but you're the one that put forth the positive claim. You must show that without god it is impossible to prove it wrong, otherwise we can all just assume you are wrong.

“Atheists cannot postulate a definition of morality that defines child molestation as morally wrong regardless of time and position.” Is a negative claim my friend; ball is in your court.

(May 22, 2013 at 2:50 pm)Tonus Wrote: I would consider it a small comfort if he was enduring punishment for his crimes, since I would rather that he had not been allowed to carry out such acts in the first place. Leaving us to our own devices, only to reward or punish us after the end, strikes me as unsatisfying.

You do not find satisfaction in eternal glory for the righteous and eternal punishment for the wicked? I sure do.

Quote: When I think of the ones whose time on Earth was cut short quickly and brutally, I wonder if their time here had any value? At the least, those who are granted the gift of a heavenly afterlife may not have gotten any chance at enjoying their time in the flesh. Do you feel that hey get another shot at it somehow, or was that short and bitter existence all they were granted, and they are probably better off just forgetting it as they delight in their heavenly reward? It seems pointless to me to have that happen to them.

Life on the New Earth will be so wonderful no one will wish they were given more time on the Old Corrupt Earth. It’s an intriguing subject though.

(May 22, 2013 at 2:24 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

(May 21, 2013 at 5:37 pm)Sal Wrote: Wow, you really are an apologetic disgusting asshole, aren'tcha?

No need for name calling sir.

Name calling? It's an accurate description.

(May 22, 2013 at 2:24 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

Quote: And you're gonna pretend that, by implication, that after people die they're gonna receive justice? No, by then it's over and done with and whatever actions they did will echo through the lives they affected.

No pretending required, Joseph Stalin is receiving justice as we speak for murdering 50 million of his fellow countryman. If God didn’t exist then he got off Scot free and died one of the most powerful men in the World. I take comfort in knowing justice was served.

You're evil for thinking that. Tell me, how long should Stalin be punished for his crime in this imaginary Hell of yours? 100 years? 1,000? Maybe we should keep score for how long each life, so each life killed becomes "adequate" to punishment received. But wait, even after, says 20 million lives times whatever amount of years per life murdered, he's gonna continue his immortal existence in Hell. That's me some "justice" right there.

(May 22, 2013 at 2:24 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

Quote: This is a far cry from justice, because it's your fucking Abrahamic religion that protects them in the first place. Ya dig?

No, I don’t “dig”, that doesn’t make a wink of sense.

That's because you're dodging the issue.

(May 22, 2013 at 2:24 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

(May 21, 2013 at 7:50 pm)Faith No More Wrote: Don't fret, Sal. Just remember that every time you hear something like "from an atheistic perspective you cannot even defend the claim that these child molesters did anything morally wrong" what they're really saying is "if it wasn't for my belief that god was watching over my shoulder, I would be out molesting children right now."

You’re usually a bit more eloquent than this FNM. No, it God didn’t exist neither of us would be here right now.

Says you.

(May 22, 2013 at 2:24 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

(May 22, 2013 at 8:49 am)Rhythm Wrote: So I guess I'm defective then. I never feel the urge to fuck a toddler, despite god designing me to do so. Maybe I shouldn't criticize your gods mistakes and cock-ups so much - at least that gives it the opportunity to get something right by accident - since it's clearly incapable of getting anything right on purpose.

No, God’s upholding grace prevents all of us from being as evil as we could be, we do not deserve any credit for not committing such evil acts. How are you defining “right” here?

Well that point went straight over your head.

(May 22, 2013 at 2:24 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

(May 22, 2013 at 8:53 am)Faith No More Wrote: I just get frustrated hearing all of this "as an atheist you can't prove something is immoral" crap, as if it is impossible to determine what you should and sh

There’s no need to get frustrated, if you believe my statement is wrong then just prove it. Provide a logically sound syllogism that proves child molestation would be wrong independent of time and place in a Universe devoid of God’s existence. If it’s sound I’ll admit I was wrong.

It's morally wrong because they don't consent to being molested, hence the word "molestation".

(May 22, 2013 at 6:38 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

(May 22, 2013 at 2:29 pm)Faith No More Wrote: Nice try, but you're the one that put forth the positive claim. You must show that without god it is impossible to prove it wrong, otherwise we can all just assume you are wrong.

“Atheists cannot postulate a definition of morality that defines child molestation as morally wrong regardless of time and position.” Is a negative claim my friend; ball is in your court.

Nice try again; he was postulating something a theist would say, but I reckon you wouldn't want to lie now? I expect nothing less from such an evil douchebag like yourself.

(May 22, 2013 at 6:38 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

(May 22, 2013 at 2:50 pm)Tonus Wrote: I would consider it a small comfort if he was enduring punishment for his crimes, since I would rather that he had not been allowed to carry out such acts in the first place. Leaving us to our own devices, only to reward or punish us after the end, strikes me as unsatisfying.

You do not find satisfaction in eternal glory for the righteous and eternal punishment for the wicked? I sure do.

Which is why you're evil. And I won't flinch in calling you evil.

Actually, never deconvert - because the only reason you're not out murdering, raping and pillaging, I reckon, is because you fear your imaginary Hell and not because you think it's wrong to do so, but because God tells you not to - not that you'd even be able to realize this Euthyphro dilemma.

So, stay deluded.

(May 22, 2013 at 6:38 pm)Statler Waldorf Wrote:

Quote: When I think of the ones whose time on Earth was cut short quickly and brutally, I wonder if their time here had any value? At the least, those who are granted the gift of a heavenly afterlife may not have gotten any chance at enjoying their time in the flesh. Do you feel that hey get another shot at it somehow, or was that short and bitter existence all they were granted, and they are probably better off just forgetting it as they delight in their heavenly reward? It seems pointless to me to have that happen to them.

Life on the New Earth will be so wonderful no one will wish they were given more time on the Old Corrupt Earth. It’s an intriguing subject though.

Pure speculation, with only religious masturbation to back it up.