I'm much more disappointed in Florida law than I am Zimmerman, although I'm certainly very disappointed with him.

Zimmerman is not a cop, and had no business confronting ANYONE about ANYTHING. In the very least, he should have been punished for that.

As a member of the Neighborhood Watch, Zimmerman needed only report suspicious behaviour and then leave it to the authorities to take the appropriate course of action. Because he played cop, instead, a confrontation developed and a man lost his life.

Florida's legal system failed to do something about that, and because of that, it's obviously in need of serious reform.

It is not illegal to confront people if you suspect them of doing illegal acts. You can also make a citizens arrest if they actually commit a crime.

(July 18, 2013 at 3:46 am)Tiberius Wrote: It is not illegal to confront people if you suspect them of doing illegal acts. You can also make a citizens arrest if they actually commit a crime.

What was Trayvon doing except walking from one place to another? After all, we do not have his testimony. All we do have, is the testimony of a piece of shit man who killed someone and deserves to rot in prison.

(July 18, 2013 at 3:49 am)Maelstrom Wrote: What was Trayvon doing except walking from one place to another?

I don't know. He doesn't know. And also it doesn't matter. I do know that somebody confronting another person cannot cause a death in and of itself, though.

(July 18, 2013 at 3:49 am)Maelstrom Wrote: What was Trayvon doing except walking from one place to another? After all, we do not have his testimony. All we do have, is the testimony of a piece of shit man who killed someone and deserves to rot in prison.

We don't know for sure what he was doing; Zimmerman claims he was looking into houses. What we do for a fact though, is that someone matching Treyvon's description was suspected of breaking into houses in the area. Zimmerman reported him based on this fact, as evidenced by the 911 call. We also know that Treyvon had been suspended from school three times that year, and had once been caught with a large amount of women's jewellery and a tool suspected of being used for burglary.

There is also the eye witness testimony of Treyvon on top of Zimmerman, beating him up.

Matching, suspected, Circumstantial evidence based on someone who cannot testify in his own defense. Matching and suspected are not facts.

People Trayvon's age are prone to testing the limits of authority. Therefore, his behavior in school is not an indicator of whether he was doing anything bad the night he was murdered.

What one person saw was one part of the interaction between the two individuals. Did the supposed witness see what led to the fight between both individuals?

(July 18, 2013 at 4:14 am)Tiberius Wrote: We don't know for sure what he was doing; Zimmerman claims he was looking into houses. What we do for a fact though, is that someone matching Treyvon's description was suspected of breaking into houses in the area. Zimmerman reported him based on this fact, as evidenced by the 911 call.

Which is where it should have stopped, especially after the voice on the other end of that 911 call told him not to pursue. Suspicion and conscientious reporting is one thing, but don't then escalate the situation against the express wishes of the people who actually know what they're doing.

Regardless of what was actually happening, all this could have been avoided if Zimmerman had just done what he was told.

Also, the whole standing his ground defense was bull. After all, it was merely what Zimmerman said against what a dead man could not state.

(July 18, 2013 at 4:41 am)Esquilax Wrote:

(July 18, 2013 at 4:14 am)Tiberius Wrote: We don't know for sure what he was doing; Zimmerman claims he was looking into houses. What we do for a fact though, is that someone matching Treyvon's description was suspected of breaking into houses in the area. Zimmerman reported him based on this fact, as evidenced by the 911 call.

Which is where it should have stopped, especially after the voice on the other end of that 911 call told him not to pursue. Suspicion and conscientious reporting is one thing, but don't then escalate the situation against the express wishes of the people who actually know what they're doing.

Regardless of what was actually happening, all this could have been avoided if Zimmerman had just done what he was told.

It could have been avoided in virtually endless ways; at least half of those limitless ways have to do with Trayvon's actions/existence... You can't pick a point and blame it for everything that follows. I could just as easily pick the point where Trayvon chose to attack and say that was the cause for the following actions, ultimately ending in Trayvon's death.

Also, Zimmerman had no duty to the other end of that 911 call. He didn't go against an order. Saying what followed suit is his fault on the basis that he chose not to head their words is the same saying it's his fault because he didn't head the words of any random person, really.

(July 18, 2013 at 5:13 am)Gilgamesh Wrote: It could have been avoided in virtually endless ways; at least half of those limitless ways have to do with Trayvon's actions/existence... You can't pick a point and blame it for everything that follows. I could just as easily pick the point where Trayvon chose to attack and say that was the cause for the following actions, ultimately ending in Trayvon's death.

You can, however, pick origin points for the trouble that occurred. One of those, in this series of bad decisions, was the point at which a grown man opted to stalk a teenager at night. Say what you like; there is no way that was a good idea.

Quote:Also, Zimmerman had no duty to the other end of that 911 call. He didn't go against an order. Saying what followed suit is his fault on the basis that he chose not to head their words is the same saying it's his fault because he didn't head the words of any random person, really.

But 911 operators aren't random people. If they were, nobody would bother calling them. What they are, are people with a working knowledge of police procedure and operations, who are put behind those phone lines specifically to help the people who call in. What they have to say in situations like these matter, because they've been trained to give instructions to maximize safety and to help the authorities that have been dispatched to do their jobs. If Zimmerman didn't want the help that 911 offers, why would he call them in the first place?

This would be like me being told to apply pressure to a wound to stop the bleeding while an ambulance rushes to my aid, tearing that wound open instead, and then being surprised when that makes things worse. After all, those people on the other end of the line are just random people, right?