(October 7, 2013 at 4:52 pm)freedomfromfallacy Wrote: [quote='Drich' pid='519762' dateline='1381178736']

Christ simply followed the traditions and spoke to the people on the terms their society had laid out for Him.

Except for this time...

Luke 2

The Boy Jesus at the Temple

41 Every year Jesus’ parents went to Jerusalem for the Festival of the Passover. 42 When he was twelve years old, they went up to the festival, according to the custom. 43 After the festival was over, while his parents were returning home, the boy Jesus stayed behind in Jerusalem, but they were unaware of it. 44 Thinking he was in their company, they traveled on for a day. Then they began looking for him among their relatives and friends. 45 When they did not find him, they went back to Jerusalem to look for him. 46 After three days they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions. 47 Everyone who heard him was amazed at his understanding and his answers. 48 When his parents saw him, they were astonished. His mother said to him, “Son, why have you treated us like this? Your father and I have been anxiously searching for you.”


Just another luke ripoff of Josephus...which was most likely bullshit, too.

Quote:2. Now, my father Matthias was not only eminent on account of is nobility, but had a higher commendation on account of his righteousness, and was in great reputation in Jerusalem, the greatest city we have. I was myself brought up with my brother, whose name was Matthias, for he was my own brother, by both father and mother; and I made mighty proficiency in the improvements of my learning, and appeared to have both a great memory and understanding. Moreover, when I was a child, and about fourteen years of age, I was commended by all for the love I had to learning; on which account the high priests and principal men of the city came then frequently to me together, in order to know my opinion about the accurate understanding of points of the law.

http://www.ccel.org/j/josephus/works/autobiog.htm

The Life of Flavius Josephus written for a Roman audience who doubtlessly considered Josephus a traitor to his people.

________________________________________________________

(October 7, 2013 at 4:45 pm)Drich Wrote: 33 is the traditional age of a well respected rabbi/teacher. In that culture, if one speaks and what he says is not like then it can simply be dismissed as being the ranting of a young person. If he speaks too wildly as a young person then by reputation could have been branded a fool. Once someone was labled a fool then everything the 'fool' said was ignored.

Christ simply followed the traditions and spoke to the people on the terms their society had laid out for Him.

That's a good answer except that Jesus was 30, not 33. Most estimates put him at 33 when he died, but then, if he could start 3 years early, why didn't he start 6 years early? It was easy to lie about your age back then, I would assume.

Quote:I was being sarcastic. I agree it's interesting. Go ahead and intend all the blasphemy you want.

Oh, I've blasphemed before and I'll do it again, don't worry about that. I just thought this was a pretty clean question, so I was gonna keep it that way (at least from me).

(October 7, 2013 at 5:12 pm)Captain Colostomy Wrote:

(October 7, 2013 at 5:05 pm)max-greece Wrote: PS - I have proven the case of being the worst carpenter in history before.

It's a three way tie:

thecarpenters

Worst carpenter? I have to give it to Jesus by a nose. At least Karen could play drums.

Science can't disprove God - true.

Science can, however, make him irrelevant. All that is left for the religious now is a God of the cracks (the gaps have shrunken that much). Each time science explains another facet of our existence God's role shrinks a little bit more, and each time that happens another percentage or so of people drop their belief.

This accelerates as a process when religious wrong-doing, or failure comes to the fore.

If I say the words - the Bishop and a Choir Boy, I'd be very surprised if the mental image you conjure up bears much similarity with the image you might have seen just 10 years ago.

These things have an effect.

(October 7, 2013 at 5:16 pm)Crossless1 Wrote:

(October 7, 2013 at 5:12 pm)Captain Colostomy Wrote: It's a three way tie:

thecarpenters

Worst carpenter? I have to give it to Jesus by a nose. At least Karen could play drums.

I thought it took two sticks to play? :p

(October 7, 2013 at 4:52 pm)freedomfromfallacy Wrote:

(October 7, 2013 at 4:45 pm)Drich Wrote: Christ simply followed the traditions and spoke to the people on the terms their society had laid out for Him.

Except for this time...

Luke 2

The Boy Jesus at the Temple

41 Every year Jesus’ parents went to Jerusalem for the Festival of the Passover. 42 When he was twelve years old, they went up to the festival, according to the custom. 43 After the festival was over, while his parents were returning home, the boy Jesus stayed behind in Jerusalem, but they were unaware of it. 44 Thinking he was in their company, they traveled on for a day. Then they began looking for him among their relatives and friends. 45 When they did not find him, they went back to Jerusalem to look for him. 46 After three days they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions. 47 Everyone who heard him was amazed at his understanding and his answers. 48 When his parents saw him, they were astonished. His mother said to him, “Son, why have you treated us like this? Your father and I have been anxiously searching for you.”


Just another luke ripoff of Josephus...which was most likely bullshit, too.

Quote:2. Now, my father Matthias was not only eminent on account of is nobility, but had a higher commendation on account of his righteousness, and was in great reputation in Jerusalem, the greatest city we have. I was myself brought up with my brother, whose name was Matthias, for he was my own brother, by both father and mother; and I made mighty proficiency in the improvements of my learning, and appeared to have both a great memory and understanding. Moreover, when I was a child, and about fourteen years of age, I was commended by all for the love I had to learning; on which account the high priests and principal men of the city came then frequently to me together, in order to know my opinion about the accurate understanding of points of the law.

http://www.ccel.org/j/josephus/works/autobiog.htm

The Life of Flavius Josephus written for a Roman audience who doubtlessly considered Josephus a traitor to his people.

________________________________________________________

I think Jesus got into the messiah business after getting tired of the turning water into wine business.

(October 7, 2013 at 5:15 pm)Beta Ray Bill Wrote: That's a good answer except that Jesus was 30, not 33.

That's the thing we do not know how old He was 3 years one way or another is not unreasonable.

Quote: Most estimates put him at 33 when he died, but then, if he could start 3 years early, why didn't he start 6 years early? It was easy to lie about your age back then, I would assume.

If your willing to over look 3 years going back then why not 3 years going forward?

If we over look your current estimated age by 3 years Christ fits the social norm for what He did with His life. Which every other indicator has Christ following upto the start of His ministry.

(October 7, 2013 at 5:17 pm)max-greece Wrote: Science can, however, make him irrelevant. All that is left for the religious now is a God of the cracks (the gaps have shrunken that much). Each time science explains another facet of our existence God's role shrinks a little bit more, and each time that happens another percentage or so of people drop their belief.

That only happens if God is used as a scientific explanation for something you don't understand. He ought to be used as the context for what we do understand.

He ought to be shelved with the other myths.