(March 3, 2014 at 6:44 am)JesusLover1 Wrote: I don't get it. I use many arguments that seemed so profound when my parents used them on me. What am I doing wrong? Guys just think. Look how vast and detailed our universe is. Look at the beauty, look at the wonder. Listen to the roar of the thunder, gaze at the majesty of the mountain ranges. How could it not have some creator, I understand maybe not the Christian God, but surely someone played a hand in it? If the universe just happened randomly, it's appearence would be spuratic, not rhyme or reason for anything. But despite our universe's flaws, it's clearly something awe-inspiring for the human mind to comprehend.

And look at earthquakes, diseases, parasites and all the little surprises that your god has concocted.

One of my favourites is a parasitic worm from Africa. Part of its life cycle involves living in the eyeball of its host, eventually sending the host blind.

Care to explain how that is part of your loving gods plan?

A metaphor my father likes to use:
God's grace and forgiveness are like if someone told you they had a new car in the driveway for you. If you just say you don't believe it's there and disregard it, it's your fault for not accepting the gift and trusting it's there, not the givers fault. It's the same with God. He gives the gift, but the person has to accept it and go see it for himself. I might have not said that perfectly, but my father often uses this one while he's preaching.

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(March 3, 2014 at 7:08 am)Zen Badger Wrote:

(March 3, 2014 at 6:44 am)JesusLover1 Wrote: I don't get it. I use many arguments that seemed so profound when my parents used them on me. What am I doing wrong? Guys just think. Look how vast and detailed our universe is. Look at the beauty, look at the wonder. Listen to the roar of the thunder, gaze at the majesty of the mountain ranges. How could it not have some creator, I understand maybe not the Christian God, but surely someone played a hand in it? If the universe just happened randomly, it's appearence would be spuratic, not rhyme or reason for anything. But despite our universe's flaws, it's clearly something awe-inspiring for the human mind to comprehend.

And look at earthquakes, diseases, parasites and all the little surprises that your god has concocted.

One of my favourites is a parasitic worm from Africa. Part of its life cycle involves living in the eyeball of its host, eventually sending the host blind.

Care to explain how that is part of your loving gods plan?

It's all because man ate from the tree and allowed sin into the world. Free will.

(March 3, 2014 at 7:02 am)JesusLover1 Wrote: It gave you the Bible and wants you to have faith in it's existance. I don't know why, but who am I to question God's motives?

Men wrote the bible.
Men claim it to have come from some god, while insisting that you have faith that it was so...
I question the motives of the people who wrote that.

And see no hand of any god anywhere...

(March 3, 2014 at 7:09 am)pocaracas Wrote:

(March 3, 2014 at 7:02 am)JesusLover1 Wrote: It gave you the Bible and wants you to have faith in it's existance. I don't know why, but who am I to question God's motives?

Men wrote the bible.
Men claim it to have come from some god, while insisting that you have faith that it was so...
I question the motives of the people who wrote that.

And see no hand of any god anywhere...

But so many have felt it's power.

(March 3, 2014 at 7:20 am)JesusLover1 Wrote:

(March 3, 2014 at 7:09 am)pocaracas Wrote: Men wrote the bible.
Men claim it to have come from some god, while insisting that you have faith that it was so...
I question the motives of the people who wrote that.

And see no hand of any god anywhere...

But so many have felt it's power.

Did they really feel it's power or something else inside of them?

(March 3, 2014 at 7:21 am)pocaracas Wrote:

(March 3, 2014 at 7:20 am)JesusLover1 Wrote: But so many have felt it's power.

Did they really feel it's power or something else inside of them?

Like what?

(March 3, 2014 at 7:23 am)JesusLover1 Wrote:

(March 3, 2014 at 7:21 am)pocaracas Wrote: Did they really feel it's power or something else inside of them?

Like what?

Wind?

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence

(March 3, 2014 at 7:34 am)JesusLover1 Wrote: Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence

So believe everything just in case.. Naturally.

(March 2, 2014 at 7:17 pm)JesusLover1 Wrote: From a scientific and logical realm, Christianity seems to make no sense.
However what atheists neglect is the spiritual realm. There is so much visible power in the relationship believers have with God. It cannot be explained through reason, but only through a personal relationship with Jesus. Study the word without skepticism, ask Jesus to guide you, meditate on Gods's goodness, and ask about spiritual experience from those who have experienced it themselves.

I don't know enough about you to make a judgment, but in some cases the relationship believers think they have with God is best explained as a psychotic break with reality.

Quick test for that: Do you believe that there are ever any grounds to kill babies as per 1 Samuel 15:3 or Psalm 137:9?