(March 11, 2014 at 6:51 pm)discipulus Wrote:

(March 11, 2014 at 6:45 pm)Deidre32 Wrote: There was no robe. There was no story. That's the point (I think?) Jacob is trying to make. It's a fictional story, which is why the 'colors of the robe' ...change. Has nothing to do with Greek translations, or anything else. I find it hilarious that Christians take a fictional tale, and add all this 'scholarly sounding' bullshit to it, to make it 'appear' like a true story. Well, if we translate it in Greek it means....this.

It's a bullshit story in any language.

So you say....

But I cannot help but wonder, if it is all just bull as you say, why are you so interested in it?

What you are doing is akin to me spending time in a forum arguing and debating with people and asking them questions about gnomes and leprechauns.

If it is all bull, as you claim, why are you so interested in asking people about bull?

You must like it an awful lot, or either be incredibly bored.

Because I once believed in it. And I don't know if I can ever get past that part of it. The part where I followed it for a long time, and like you, witnessed my faith to others. And for what? A lie?

It is a lie, discipulus. I know you don't or won't see it that way, but maybe someday ...you will be on the other side, just like I am, now. And while I've come a long way, it's very hard to get past knowing that a religion like Christianity has prospered for so long, by duping people.

This is what I feel, anyways. And why are you posting here? To save us wretches from eternal damnation? lol

(March 11, 2014 at 6:51 pm)discipulus Wrote:

(March 11, 2014 at 6:49 pm)rasetsu Wrote: Is this the word of God, or the fallible words of men?

Judge for yourself, for it will be you and you alone who will bear the burden of accepting or rejecting the content of the Bible.

If you judge it to be rubbish then fine. Judge it and move on. Many who have come before you have done just that. Many there will be who will come after you who will do the same.

Fine, I'll restate the question for the benefit of an evasive jerkoff.

Do you, disciplus, believe the bible is the infallible word of God, or a fallible work of men?

(March 11, 2014 at 6:55 pm)Deidre32 Wrote:

(March 11, 2014 at 6:51 pm)discipulus Wrote: So you say....

But I cannot help but wonder, if it is all just bull as you say, why are you so interested in it?

What you are doing is akin to me spending time in a forum arguing and debating with people and asking them questions about gnomes and leprechauns.

If it is all bull, as you claim, why are you so interested in asking people about bull?

You must like it an awful lot, or either be incredibly bored.

Because I once believed in it. And I don't know if I can ever get past that part of it. The part where I followed it for a long time, and like you, witnessed my faith to others. And for what? A lie?

It is a lie, discipulus. I know you don't or won't see it that way, but maybe someday ...you will be on the other side, just like I am, now. And while I've come a long way, it's very hard to get past knowing that a religion like Christianity has prospered for so long, by duping people.

This is what I feel, anyways.

Nah, you have just been duped Deidre. Somewhere along the way you became jaded with Christianity. Since you have never been born again or have experienced what it is like to have a personal intimate relationship with Jesus, this is to be expected.

You grew up in a Christian home maybe. You probably went to church often and sang the songs and read the bible and hung out with friends and had the warm fuzzies on several occassions, but you never saw yourself in desperate need of being saved. You never saw yourself as a sinner. So it follows logically that you would never come to the end of yourself and cry out to be saved from eternal separation from God.

Now you have abandoned Christianity and in order to silence the voice of conviction you rail and rant and rave viciously at anyone who speaks the truth. You try to drown that voice of reason that whispers to you in the innermost part of your being by a multiplicity of words and arguments that you yourself know are simply ridiculous.

By your own admission you have not been born from above and therefore you cannot see the kingdom of God.

Those that do hunger and thirst after righteousness will be filled Deidre.

I believe you hunger now. I believe that is why you are here.

---

(March 11, 2014 at 7:01 pm)rasetsu Wrote:

(March 11, 2014 at 6:51 pm)discipulus Wrote: Judge for yourself, for it will be you and you alone who will bear the burden of accepting or rejecting the content of the Bible.

If you judge it to be rubbish then fine. Judge it and move on. Many who have come before you have done just that. Many there will be who will come after you who will do the same.

Fine, I'll restate the question for the benefit of an evasive jerkoff.

Do you, disciplus, believe the bible is the infallible word of God, or a fallible work of men?

I believe the Words of God are true and that they endure forever.

(March 11, 2014 at 7:03 pm)discipulus Wrote:

(March 11, 2014 at 6:55 pm)Deidre32 Wrote: Because I once believed in it. And I don't know if I can ever get past that part of it. The part where I followed it for a long time, and like you, witnessed my faith to others. And for what? A lie?

It is a lie, discipulus. I know you don't or won't see it that way, but maybe someday ...you will be on the other side, just like I am, now. And while I've come a long way, it's very hard to get past knowing that a religion like Christianity has prospered for so long, by duping people.

This is what I feel, anyways.

Nah, you have just been duped Deidre. Somewhere along the way you became jaded with Christianity. Since you have never been born again or have experienced what it is like to have a personal intimate relationship with Jesus, this is to be expected.

You grew up in a Christian home maybe. You probably went to church often and sang the songs and read the bible and hung out with friends and had the warm fuzzies on several occassions, but you never saw yourself in desperate need of being saved. You never saw yourself as a sinner. So it follows logically that you would never come to the end of yourself and cry out to be saved from eternal separation from God.

Now you have abandoned Christianity and in order to silence the voice of conviction you rail and rant and rave viciously at anyone who speaks the truth. You try to drown that voice of reason that whispers to you in the innermost part of your being by a multiplicity of words and arguments that you yourself know are simply ridiculous.

By your own admission you have not been born from above and therefore you cannot see the kingdom of God.

Those that do hunger and thirst after righteousness will be filled Deidre.

I believe you hunger now. I believe that is why you are here.

No one has ever talked to me like this. So, why are you here?

(March 11, 2014 at 5:52 pm)discipulus Wrote: I do not think what you have told me is an insurmountable problem. If the gospels writers were indeed inspired by God to write what they did, I believe their accounts must not contradict one another.

I think I see the problem.

(March 11, 2014 at 6:51 pm)discipulus Wrote: But I cannot help but wonder, if it is all just bull as you say, why are you so interested in it?

What you are doing is akin to me spending time in a forum arguing and debating with people and asking them questions about gnomes and leprechauns.

So tell us, if there were a billion people that were trying to force their 'gnome and leprechaun' morality on you, were trying to get 'gnome and leprechaun' based pseudoscience taught to your kids in public schools, trying to get 'gnome and leprechaun' prayers mandated in schools, persecuted minorities based on 'gnome and leprechaun' scripture, etc, you wouldn't be a bit vocal about it?

Quote:If it is all bull, as you claim, why are you so interested in asking people about bull?

Can't speak for everyone here, but I love debate. I am very interested in what people believe, and why they believe it.

I want to believe in as many true things and as few false things as possible. I want my internal beliefs to map to reality as closely as possible. If someone has a good reason (evidence based) to believe something I don't, I want to know about it.

(March 11, 2014 at 7:08 pm)Deidre32 Wrote:

(March 11, 2014 at 7:03 pm)discipulus Wrote: Nah, you have just been duped Deidre. Somewhere along the way you became jaded with Christianity. Since you have never been born again or have experienced what it is like to have a personal intimate relationship with Jesus, this is to be expected.

You grew up in a Christian home maybe. You probably went to church often and sang the songs and read the bible and hung out with friends and had the warm fuzzies on several occassions, but you never saw yourself in desperate need of being saved. You never saw yourself as a sinner. So it follows logically that you would never come to the end of yourself and cry out to be saved from eternal separation from God.

Now you have abandoned Christianity and in order to silence the voice of conviction you rail and rant and rave viciously at anyone who speaks the truth. You try to drown that voice of reason that whispers to you in the innermost part of your being by a multiplicity of words and arguments that you yourself know are simply ridiculous.

By your own admission you have not been born from above and therefore you cannot see the kingdom of God.

Those that do hunger and thirst after righteousness will be filled Deidre.

I believe you hunger now. I believe that is why you are here.

No one has ever talked to me like this. So, why are you here?

I am here for anyone who is willing to hear the truth. I am here because there was a time in my life when I did not care about anyone, even myself. But there were people who loved me even when I was unlovable and they showed me who God was, not by clever arguments or lofty knowledge, but by encouraging me, helping me, listening to my problems, comforting me when I was suffering from depression and a host of other ills. They showed me by their actions what love was. They met me where I was and did not demand anything from me. When I laughed in their faces and cursed their name and their God, they still loved me.

I used to rail against Christians more than anyone here. At one point in time I could make someone like Minimalist look like a saint. I cursed and railed and reviled the name of Christ and anyone who spoke His name.

But despite all of this waywardness, when I needed Jesus the most, He was right there waiting for me.

I did not come to know Him through a philosophical argument or a logical empirical proof. I came to know Him when I took what I knew and said: "God, if you are real, help me."

And Deidre, He did!

Quote:I do not think you read what I wrote.

I don't give a flying fuck what you wrote. Jake made the point that these were different colors.

I regard that as minor when compared to the nativity fuck-ups or the passover/day before passover crucifixion fuck-ups but what Jake said was accurate and you are trying oh-so-desperately to salvage your gospels.

Who gives a shit?

(March 11, 2014 at 7:08 pm)Deidre32 Wrote: No one has ever talked to me like this. So, why are you here?

It's called a mind fuck. (He owes you breakfast.)

(March 11, 2014 at 7:03 pm)discipulus Wrote:

(March 11, 2014 at 7:01 pm)rasetsu Wrote: Fine, I'll restate the question for the benefit of an evasive jerkoff.

Do you, disciplus, believe the bible is the infallible word of God, or a fallible work of men?

I believe the Words of God are true and that they endure forever.

And you still didn't answer the question. Are you capable of giving a straight answer to this question?