So the conclusion is that they never should have come there?

The mafia knows that you don't send an army to kill one man.

Too noticeable.

(April 13, 2014 at 10:17 pm)Minimalist Wrote: The mafia knows that you don't send an army to kill one man.

Too noticeable.

The problem is that one man became allies with another man by the name of Mullah Omar Muhammad, the leader of the taliban. We asked Omar to give up bin laden he said "I'm a pashto it is within my traditions to defend my guests with my life" So what should've been a special forces operation turned out to be a conventional war because of the forces involved. We also can't ignore the fact that they bin and omar became fuck-buddies over jihad against America because of American support of Israel in Palestine. So now Al Qaeda and the Taliban are swearing to take our country down if we go after the 9-11 masterminds. Well, eradicating both groups is of international interest and we'll have to fight them sooner or later and there you have it, The afghan war.

(April 13, 2014 at 10:56 pm)Senshi Wrote:

(April 13, 2014 at 10:17 pm)Minimalist Wrote: The mafia knows that you don't send an army to kill one man.

Too noticeable.

The problem is that one man became allies with another man by the name of Mullah Omar Muhammad, the leader of the taliban. We asked Omar to give up bin laden he said "I'm a pashto it is within my traditions to defend my guests with my life" So what should've been a special forces operation turned out to be a conventional war because of the forces involved. We also can't ignore the fact that they bin and omar became fuck-buddies over jihad against America because of American support of Israel in Palestine. So now Al Qaeda and the Taliban are swearing to take our country down if we go after the 9-11 masterminds. Well, eradicating both groups is of international interest and we'll have to fight them sooner or later and there you have it, The afghan war.

So they should have come to afghanistan?

(April 13, 2014 at 9:39 pm)tor Wrote: So the conclusion is that they never should have come there?

Not to be a dick but...
So the conclusion is that they should've never went there.

Taliban and Al Qaeda both want you dead or Muslim and all of your belongings including any women related to you pregnant with their babies. Forget the politics it's in their core beliefs.

FROM THE QURAN - 33:50
"Prophet, We have made lawful to you the wives whom you have granted dowries and the slave girls whom God has given you as booty;..."

9:29
Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.

(April 13, 2014 at 11:07 pm)Senshi Wrote:

(April 13, 2014 at 9:39 pm)tor Wrote: So the conclusion is that they never should have come there?

Not to be a dick but...
So the conclusion is that they should've never went there.

Taliban and Al Qaeda both want you dead or Muslim and all of your belongings including any women related to you pregnant with their babies. Forget the politics it's in their core beliefs.

FROM THE QURAN - 33:50
"Prophet, We have made lawful to you the wives whom you have granted dowries and the slave girls whom God has given you as booty;..."

9:29
Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.

Yeah but if somebody wants me dead in africa he is in africa not in my house. When he will try to cross the border then I can kill him. But I'm not sure walking into his house and killing him just because he wants me dead is good idea. Not to mention killing bunch of bystanders along the way and losing some of my soldiers.

(April 13, 2014 at 11:10 pm)tor Wrote:

(April 13, 2014 at 11:07 pm)Senshi Wrote: Not to be a dick but...
So the conclusion is that they should've never went there.

Taliban and Al Qaeda both want you dead or Muslim and all of your belongings including any women related to you pregnant with their babies. Forget the politics it's in their core beliefs.

FROM THE QURAN - 33:50
"Prophet, We have made lawful to you the wives whom you have granted dowries and the slave girls whom God has given you as booty;..."

9:29
Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture - [fight] until they give the jizyah willingly while they are humbled.

Yeah but if somebody wants me dead in africa he is in africa not in my house. When he will try to cross the border then I can kill him. But I'm not sure walking into his house and killing him just because he wants me dead is good idea. Not to mention killing bunch of bystanders along the way and losing some of my soldiers.

Your mind would quickly change if you were working in the twin towers. Sometimes their plans are flawless, you have no choice but to be preemptive! Soldier became soldiers knowing they may lose their lives for the cause of protecting the home land.

(April 13, 2014 at 11:13 pm)Senshi Wrote:

(April 13, 2014 at 11:10 pm)tor Wrote: Yeah but if somebody wants me dead in africa he is in africa not in my house. When he will try to cross the border then I can kill him. But I'm not sure walking into his house and killing him just because he wants me dead is good idea. Not to mention killing bunch of bystanders along the way and losing some of my soldiers.

Your mind would quickly change if you were working in the twin towers. Sometimes their plans are flawless, you have no choice but to be preemptive! Soldier became soldiers knowing they may lose their lives for the cause of protecting the home land.

If americans would not go to afghanistan what bad would happen?
You have to choices.
1. Go to war in afghanistan.
2. Not go to war in afghanistan.
You evaluate consequences of both choices.
How do the consequences of the first option better than the second option?

Quote:"I'm a pashto it is within my traditions to defend my guests with my life" So what should've been a special forces operation turned out to be a conventional war because of the forces involved.

That's a non sequitur. OBL had plenty of help in Pakistan (apparently) and a spec/ops team did just fine.

Time to face reality. We sent at ary because Bush wanted to send an army.

Quote:If americans would not go to afghanistan what bad would happen?
You have to choices.
1. Go to war in afghanistan.
2. Not go to war in afghanistan.
You evaluate consequences of both choices.
How do the consequences of the first option better than the second option?

Go to war:
-Lose soldiers and innocent civilians
-Risk developing a bigger opposition against you
-Spend billions of dollars
-Weaken extremist groups who you know for sure are continuously plotting against you.
-Bring the masterminds of the 9/11 attack to justice

Not go to war
-Spare many lives both military and civilians
-Save money
-Allow the opposition time to grow in strength and abilities
-Risk future attacks that ARE in development
-Send a message of 'no-retaliation'
-Not bring those responsible for 9/11 to justice

[/quote]

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(April 13, 2014 at 11:39 pm)Minimalist Wrote:

Quote:"I'm a pashto it is within my traditions to defend my guests with my life" So what should've been a special forces operation turned out to be a conventional war because of the forces involved.

That's a non sequitur. OBL had plenty of help in Pakistan (apparently) and a spec/ops team did just fine.

Time to face reality. We sent at ary because Bush wanted to send an army.

And does taking out OBL imply the end of Al Qaeda or the the Taliban?

Sure SF can clear a building stupendously, but a country?