To say that it wasn't founded on protestant Christian principles that were basically taken for granted is splitting hairs and really doesn't matter any more. The USA is now a post-Christian nation.

Not post Christian enough for my liking, but patience was never one my strong points.

Quote:To say that it wasn't founded on protestant Christian principles that were basically taken for granted is splitting hairs and really doesn't matter any more.

It was founded on Enlightenment principles which were a direct repudiation of xtian horseshit.

Quote:Twenty years after the death of Luther there were more Catholics than when he was born. And twenty years after the death of Voltaire there were millions less than when he was born.
-- Robert Green Ingersoll

(October 2, 2014 at 8:59 pm)Alex K Wrote: @L.A.F.2

Wait, so you're saying it isn't? I'm sure our slaveowning heroes had something to say about that...

Of course it's not. Basic knowledge of the framers and their writings shows us that this country was clearly intended to be secular.

(October 2, 2014 at 7:56 pm)radical97 Wrote: America is not a Christian nation and was NOT founded in Christian principles whatever the hell that means. George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, James Monroe, John Quincy Adams, Andrew Jackson and Abraham Lincoln did not believe in Christianity. In fact, Jefferson, who practically wrote the whole Declaration of Independence by himself and Madison who did the same with the Constitution both despised Christianity along with other religions.

If the U.S. was founded on the Christian religion, the Constitution would clearly say so, but it does not. Nowhere does the Constitution say: "The United States is a Christian Nation", or anything even close to that. In fact, the words "Jesus Christ, Christianity, Bible, Creator, Divine, and God" are never mentioned in the Constitution; not even once.

The Declaration of Independence gives us important insight into the opinions of the Founding Fathers. Thomas Jefferson wrote that the power of the government is derived from the governed. Up until that time, it was claimed that kings ruled nations by the authority of God. The Declaration was a radical departure from the idea that the power to rule over other people comes from god. It was a letter from the Colonies to the English King, stating their intentions to seperate themselves. The Declaration is not a governing document. It mentions "Nature's God" and "Divine Providence"-- but as you will soon see, that's the language of Deism, not Christianity.

The 1796 Treaty with Tripoli states that the United States was "not in any sense founded on the Christian religion". This was not an idle statement meant to satisfy muslims-- they believed it and meant it. This treaty was written under the presidency of George Washington and signed under the presidency of John Adams.

"The divinity of Jesus is made a convenient cover for absurdity. Nowhere in the Gospels do we find a precept for Creeds, Confessions, Oaths, Doctrines, and whole cartloads of other foolish trumpery that we find in Christianity."
"This would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it."
JOHN ADAMS

“I have recently been examining all the known superstitions of the world, and do not find in our particular superstition of Christianity* one redeeming feature. They are all alike, founded upon fables and mythologies.” Thomas Jefferson * /Some variations of this quote may have: [Christianity]

"As I understand the Christian religion, it was, and is, a revelation. But how has it happened that millions of fables, tales, legends, have been blended with both Jewish and Christian revelation that have made them the most bloody religion that ever existed?"
John Adams - letter to F.A. Van der Kamp, Dec. 27, 1816

Educate yourself with something besides that 'I hate God 'propaganda mini is drawn to. Something like a legit historical source material. Otherwise some one like me who wants nothing more than to make new members look the fool for not fact checking their anti God propaganda they get themselves worked up on will feed it back to you.

Jefferson: while jefferson did not support the various religious institutions of his day he established and maintained a personal relationship with God through Christ.
http://www.monticello.org/site/research-...e/Religion

Adams: Adams was a devout in his beliefs concerning God as a Unitarian.
http://johnadamsinfo.com/was-john-adams-a-christian/92/

Washington: Washington was what we refer to as a deacon in his church, even later in life having twice daily devotions.
http://www.mountvernon.org/research-coll...-religion/

Lincoln: you have to be completely ignorant or high if you believe Lincoln did not believe in God. He referenced and petitioned God in his public speeches all the time!!
The burden of the war put Lincoln on his knees in prayer everyday.
http://www.abrahamlincolnonline.org/linc...quotes.htm

Jackson: Was a FRIGGEN presbyterian minister after he was president!!!
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_Jackson

Madison:
Was an Episcopalian, he attended church while president every Sunday
His bid to keep church and state seperate was to keep the state from sanctioning a national religion like the Church of England. He knew this would mean a civil war,therefore when representing the state dealing with any matters of the church was off limits. This was to preserve minority sects of christianity from begin over run by the larger brands.
http://www.adherents.com/people/pm/James_Madison.html
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious...ted_States
Referencing the site above the only president that did not affiliate himself with some form of Christianity is Monroe.

That is why we are referred to as a Christian nation.

(October 2, 2014 at 10:26 pm)Drich Wrote: Educate yourself with something besides that 'I hate God 'propaganda mini is drawn to. Something like a legit historical source material. Otherwise some one like me who wants nothing more than to make new members look the fool for not fact checking their anti God propaganda they get themselves worked up on will feed it back to you.
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Referencing the site above the only president that did not affiliate himself with some form of Christianity is Monroe.

That is why we are referred to as a Christian nation.

You should have stopped after giving evidence for religious affiliations of founding fathers. Their religious affiliation does not make your country a Christian nation. Concluding that it does makes you look like a fool.

The guy who wrote the article on Washington:
http://www.georgetsakiridis.com/about/

Some of his other works:
http://www.amazon.com/George-Tsakiridis/e/B0038P1BRK

Makes me doubt the voracity of his claims.

As for Lincoln, it's kind of funny that he didn't start with the God references until he started running for office. Jefferson was a big fan of the French Revolution so it's hard for me to believe he was having a personal relationship with Christ. Apparently his relationship didn't really begin until after being accused of being an atheist in the 1790s. Those were the only links I had time to peruse at the moment. After reading them I can still say with confidence, the United States was not founded as a Christian state. Would there be a need for the First Amendment if it were? How could Rhode Island have been allowed to join such a nation?

Quote:That is why we are referred to as a Christian nation.

Only by fucking ignorant dickheads like you, drippy.

Remember:

Quote:Millions of innocent men, women, and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, and imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch toward uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one-half the world fools and the other half hypocrites. To support roguery and error all over the earth.
-- Thomas Jefferson,

Jefferson had you jesus freak assholes nailed.

(October 2, 2014 at 10:05 pm)L.A.F.2. Wrote:

(October 2, 2014 at 8:59 pm)Alex K Wrote: @L.A.F.2

Wait, so you're saying it isn't? I'm sure our slaveowning heroes had something to say about that...

Of course it's not. Basic knowledge of the framers and their writings shows us that this country was clearly intended to be secular.

I was talking about the "for white men" part...

(October 2, 2014 at 10:26 pm)Drich Wrote: That is why we are referred to as a Christian nation.

If that's the criteria you're going by, then America is also a Male Nation, a White Nation, a Dead Person Nation, and a Pants Wearing Nation, among many other things. I doubt you'd ever agree out loud to the first two, and the last two should demonstrate how devoid of meaning your definition of a "Christian Nation" actually is.

But then, what you mean isn't what the people arguing for a christian nation generally mean when they do so in a political context, is it? You're either trying to win cheap rhetorical points by contracting the definition into something manageable so you can get one over on the atheists and accuse them of hating god (yawn ) or you're equivocating.

Which is it?