(June 23, 2015 at 10:15 am)Esquilax Wrote:

(June 22, 2015 at 11:12 pm)Randy Carson Wrote: I ask myself that every time I read the posts from some members of this forum.

Right, so, the questions I asked you on page one, about your little tantrum; are you ever going to answer them? Or are you going to go from toddler tantrum to running away?

Boy, sure showing us how mature you are there.

Neither. I'm going to let Trent Horn's piece speak for itself. It does so adequately enough.

(June 23, 2015 at 6:25 pm)Randy Carson Wrote: And after the day of Pentecost?

They went out and turned the world upside down. How did that happen?

I don't understand how this addresses my point.

(June 23, 2015 at 6:31 pm)Tonus Wrote:

(June 23, 2015 at 6:25 pm)Randy Carson Wrote: And after the day of Pentecost?

They went out and turned the world upside down. How did that happen?

I don't understand how this addresses my point.

I'm agreeing with you. The apostles were powerfully transformed by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit on Pentecost. The world was transformed, as well.

(June 23, 2015 at 6:31 pm)Randy Carson Wrote:

(June 23, 2015 at 10:15 am)Esquilax Wrote: Right, so, the questions I asked you on page one, about your little tantrum; are you ever going to answer them? Or are you going to go from toddler tantrum to running away?

Boy, sure showing us how mature you are there.

Neither. I'm going to let Trent Horn's piece speak for itself. It does so adequately enough.

Oh? The one I already tore apart the last time it came up?

The one, incidentally, that you don't let speak at all, since it doesn't appear anywhere in this thread?

Either way, it's a bit pitiful that you think that burden shifting garbage is a cogent argument. If the best you have is a combination of dictating the position of others to them, and grandstanding over their willingness to be intellectually honest, then you don't have much of a case at all. In fact it's worse in your case, because you don't even have the wherewithal to explain your own position.

So I ask again: what is your basis for accusing us of having a presupposition against your claim?

Trent Horn is a pious douchebag.  What else would you expect Randy to parrot?

(June 23, 2015 at 6:28 pm)Randy Carson Wrote:

(June 23, 2015 at 8:14 am)Cato Wrote: Randy,

I ponied up the same thing on the first page of the thread. Any chance you'll get around to addressing it?

Is it your opinion that Mark knew nothing of the resurrection despite travelling with both Peter and Paul at various times?

To think otherwise would require one to conclude the author of Mark intentionally omitted what is perhaps the most important part of the story.

(June 23, 2015 at 6:31 pm)Randy Carson Wrote:

(June 23, 2015 at 10:15 am)Esquilax Wrote: Right, so, the questions I asked you on page one, about your little tantrum; are you ever going to answer them? Or are you going to go from toddler tantrum to running away?

Boy, sure showing us how mature you are there.

Neither. I'm going to let Trent Horn's piece speak for itself. It does so adequately enough.

In plain words, you can't form a cogent argument so you're going to rely on others to do your speaking (and likely thinking) for you.

Color me unimpressed.

(June 22, 2015 at 11:12 pm)Randy Carson Wrote:

(June 22, 2015 at 8:13 am)Stimbo Wrote: Wow. Pointing to one bit of a story to evidence another bit of the story. How old do you think we are, Randy?

I ask myself that every time I read the posts from some members of this forum.

Stimbo points out your circular logic, and the best you can do is ad hominem.

Why should we expect any better?

As I pointed out in another thread weeks ago, you came here with the claim that you were going to argue from logic and reason, yet your posts are loaded with just about every fallacy there is. 

Count me as another who is unimpressed.

https://youtu.be/gYNUOkqzcVA

(June 17, 2015 at 7:12 pm)Randy Carson Wrote:

1. No miracles can occur in the nature of things.
   
2. #1 logically follows because, of course, under fundamental atheist presuppositions, there is no God to perform any miracle.
   
3. The New Testament documents are fundamentally untrustworthy and historically suspect, having been written by gullible, partisan Christians; particularly because, for most facts presented therein, there is not (leaving aside archaeological evidences) written secular corroborating evidence.
   
4. Some atheists even claim (or suspect) that Jesus didn't exist at all (making such a topic even more absurd and ludicrous (given that premise) than it already is in atheist eyes).  
   

This isn't exactly how I would word these. Mine might sound a little more like this:


1. There is currently no evidenced reason to believe that miracles occur in nature.

2. There is no currently no evidenced reason to believe that any gods exist.

3. There is observable evidence to suggest that the bible contradicts observable reality on various points, and furthermore there is evidence to suggest that the bible is a collection of mythical stories conceived, written, and influenced by humans with the purposes of explaining things they did not understand and ordering society as they saw fit.

4. There is currently no evidenced reason to believe that Jesus of Nazareth existed at all, and even if he did there is no evidenced reason to believe that the wild, fantastical, biblical claims about him are true.

5. Scripture is the claim, and is therefore NEVER proof of itself.


To eliminate any one of these suppositions, all you have to do is use evidence to prove it false and unreasonable. Until then, there is no reason to consider the question of whether god exists in our reality without these suppositions in place.