America's obsession with guns

[Brian37]

I'll at least give you that. Yea, nobody needs to be walking down the street with an open AR-15 and nobody really needs one in any case. I do think far too many people confuse wants with needs. You need a car, you want a Lamborghini. You need food, you want Beluga caviar. 

But again, what makes you think open or not, that every time you introduce a gun into a conflict where the person you are confronting has one too, that the outcome will always have you winning? Because why? Your intent? Reality doesn't give one fuck about your intent. In real life using a firearm under stressful conflict requires constant training. Your intent does not equal training.

If someone walks up  behind you and sticks a gun in your back, the odds of you pulling your gun out and hitting them before they pull the trigger, is pretty damned slim. If you are smart odds are you give them what they want and you walk away alive. The only way to be prepared in a gunfight, is to know ahead of time WITH stress training, what you are getting into. It isn't enough to simply mentally masturbate with "In this case, I would do this".

Your mentality is dangerous TO YOU. You are confusing your own good intent while ignoring the training it takes to use a firearm properly. 

Even outside the issue of guns. I have seen this bullshit testosterone mentality even with mere fist fights. "If you called my mother a whore, I'd beat the shit out of you"...... I've seen lots of people claim "I know what I am doing" and play street lawyer and say what they would do, then end up in trouble.

I am sure you have good intent and think you know what you are doing. But, just like god belief, I think you are merely giving yourself a false sense of comfort. With guns, there is no room for error and it only takes one mistake to end up hurting yourself or others even unintentionally.  Target shooting is not the same as stress shooting. Stress use of a firearm is constant training not a one time class.

You don't know anything about my training or skills or how I behave.

I avoid sketchy looking places. I don't look for trouble, on the contrary I avoid it.

The gun is the last ditch effort to protect myself or family. You don't and won't agree with that and I'm ok with it. You keep preaching long sermons about guns and really I just skip over it like it's a broken record because that's what it sounds like.

You are right, I dont. But my bet is on not much. Most non police and non military get trained with target shooting and even concealed permits for non jobs are not long term constant training. My guess is unless you are a long term cop or long term military, your training amounts to a certification periodically which is not the same as living it every day as if you had a job which required you to use a firearm.

"last ditch effort". Unless you live near Isis, I am not sure where you live that you cant figure out more non lethal ways of defending your home. NOW again, for home protection, if its that bad where you live, I can be more understanding. But again, that you cannot, even with that need, delude yourself into thinking your mere intent represents the same outcome every time you pull your weapon. 

Lets say you are out with your family with your concealed weapon. Someone pulls a gun on you and a family member, you reach for your gun, but before you can fire back, they hit your loved one. If you think accidents never happen with good intent, again, you are fooling yourself. 

Someone who already has a firearm aimed at you already has the drop on you. If you do anything while owning a firearm, which I am AGAIN not calling for an all out ban, at least FOR YOU think about those odds. 

It isn't even that you own one, but your attitude. Guns are not forgiving and you cannot think like a Hollywood movie where every case of use ends up with the good guy winning.

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You don't know anything about my training or skills or how I behave.

I avoid sketchy looking places. I don't look for trouble, on the contrary I avoid it.

The gun is the last ditch effort to protect myself or family. You don't and won't agree with that and I'm ok with it. You keep preaching long sermons about guns and really I just skip over it like it's a broken record because that's what it sounds like.

You are right, I dont. But my bet is on not much. Most non police and non military get trained with target shooting and even concealed permits for non jobs are not long term constant training. My guess is unless you are a long term cop or long term military, your training amounts to a certification periodically which is not the same as living it every day as if you had a job which required you to use a firearm.

"last ditch effort". Unless you live near Isis, I am not sure where you live that you cant figure out more non lethal ways of defending your home. NOW again, for home protection, if its that bad where you live, I can be more understanding. But again, that you cannot, even with that need, delude yourself into thinking your mere intent represents the same outcome every time you pull your weapon. 

Lets say you are out with your family with your concealed weapon. Someone pulls a gun on you and a family member, you reach for your gun, but before you can fire back, they hit your loved one. If you think accidents never happen with good intent, again, you are fooling yourself. 

Someone who already has a firearm aimed at you already has the drop on you. If you do anything while owning a firearm, which I am AGAIN not calling for an all out ban, at least FOR YOU think about those odds. 

It isn't even that you own one, but your attitude. Guns are not forgiving and you cannot think like a Hollywood movie where every case of use ends up with the good guy winning.

[KUSA]

Nope. I don't walk down the sidewalk with an AR15. I have a concealed handgun.

If you walk up behind me and stick me in the kidney, I will turn around and put at least two rounds in your face and then call 911.

Nice bluster.

It's not a bluster. If you stab me I will put some ventilation holes in your skull.

[Brian37]

Nice bluster.

It's not a bluster. If you stab me I will put some ventilation holes in your skull.

So you are stupidly assuming everyone who has ill intent has a knife? Again what if they have a gun to your back or head? What then? You think life is a video game and they won't be able to pull the trigger before you draw? 

You might have a slight advantage over a knife sure, but what if the person has a gun?

It is bluster. Knife or gun, reality does not give one fuck about your good intent. Constant training is what increases the survival of a stressful event, not the weapon itself.

I think you should value more situational conflict training more than defaulting to use of a weapon of any kind. People also survive by deescalation and fleeing. Your brain, regardless is your most important tool. 

Even outside the issue of guns, any sane lifeguard will tell you, TRAINING is what increases the chance, not only of your own survival, but also of the victim you are trying to save. 

Having a gun is not a utopia. It matters far more how you respond to stress, not the weapon you are facing. 

"I'm not going down without a fight" is Hollywood crap. Survival even with other life is adaptation, not always brawn or force.

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KUSA, I grew up with nothing but bullies on my street. You'd be one of those guys who'd say "The only thing they understand is a fight". Not true, even when I did fight back, I got my ass kicked.

That is more understandable as a kid. But as an adult you cant think like John Wayne or Dirty Harry or play street lawyer with a weapon.

I have avoided being robbed as an adult TWICE in my life without using a fire arm. I have also avoided being assaulted without a firearm as an adult. The reason I did, was situational awareness, remaining calm, and looking for the path of least resistance. Talk is cheap, and the ones who brag about being a hero are the ones most likely to be the first to get hurt.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Nice bluster.

It's not a bluster. If you stab me I will put some ventilation holes in your skull.

If you catch me doing it. If I stab you in the back you're not going to be doing much.

[KUSA]

Lets say you are out with your family with your concealed weapon. Someone pulls a gun on you and a family member, you reach for your gun, but before you can fire back, they hit your loved one. If you think accidents never happen with good intent, again, you are fooling yourself. 

If someone had a gun pointed at me and wanted my wallet, I would simply give it to them and not try to make a bad situation worse. The petty cash in my wallet is of little value to me. I have plenty more in the bank.

For some reason you think you know what I would do in every situation. You don't.

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It's not a bluster. If you stab me I will put some ventilation holes in your skull.

If you catch me doing it. If I stab you in the back you're not going to be doing much.

You seem to think that people instantly die when stabbed. This is not the walking dead.

How many people have you stabbed in the back anyway?

[Brian37]

Lets say you are out with your family with your concealed weapon. Someone pulls a gun on you and a family member, you reach for your gun, but before you can fire back, they hit your loved one. If you think accidents never happen with good intent, again, you are fooling yourself. 

If someone had a gun pointed at me and wanted my wallet, I would simply give it to them and not try to make a bad situation worse. The petty cash in my wallet is of little value to me. I have plenty more in the bank.

For some reason you think you know what I would do in every situation. You don't.

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If you catch me doing it. If I stab you in the back you're not going to be doing much.

You seem to think that people instantly die when stabbed. This is not the walking dead.

How many people have you stabbed in the back anyway?

WAY TO MISS THE POINT 

Knife or gun, your bullshit attitude of thinking a utopia outcome will always occur if you just stand up to them. THAT is the fucking problem.

So you have a gun and they have a knife? They stab you, hit a vital blood vessel, sure you might not die suddenly, but again your statement sounds like you assume you are Ninja and the pain of the stab wont effect your response. No you might not die suddenly, but you are stupidly assuming if they stab you it will always be superficial. 

So you'd rather die by stabbing, because you have a gun just so you can fire back? Sounds stupid to me. 

Even if you're  confronted by  someone with a knife you are STILL stupidly concocting in your head a Hollywood outcome. 

Ok fine, AGAIN, WHAT IF it is NOT a knife, and it is a GUN sticking in your back, or aimed at your head? What then?

You still keep missing the point, that TRAINING is far more important. What matters is that you survive, not the weapon you use. If it requires losing your property or having your ego bruised, or fleeing, you still survived. TRAINING matters far more than the weapon you are up against, or the weapon you use. 

If you cannot accept that, then you really have no business having a firearm. Those who accept the fact that guns are not forgiving, and accept their brain matters more, are the ones to trust. The ones who talk shit, are far more likely to do stupid shit.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Lets say you are out with your family with your concealed weapon. Someone pulls a gun on you and a family member, you reach for your gun, but before you can fire back, they hit your loved one. If you think accidents never happen with good intent, again, you are fooling yourself. 

If someone had a gun pointed at me and wanted my wallet, I would simply give it to them and not try to make a bad situation worse. The petty cash in my wallet is of little value to me. I have plenty more in the bank.

For some reason you think you know what I would do in every situation. You don't.

---

If you catch me doing it. If I stab you in the back you're not going to be doing much.

You seem to think that people instantly die when stabbed. This is not the walking dead.

How many people have you stabbed in the back anyway?

Six, iirc. But not TV stabbing, I kept at it until they were dead. You are full of shit if you think you can just shrug off a Gerber Mk II in the guts.

[Catholic_Lady]

It's just part of the culture I suppose. There are a lot of people here who like to go shooting/hunting as a hobby, also people here like the idea of freedom from the government and they feel it is their right to own guns if they want to.

[KUSA]

So you are stupidly assuming everyone who has ill intent has a knife?

Nope. You are asserting that.

Again what if they have a gun to your back or head? What then? You think life is a video game and they won't be able to pull the trigger before you draw? 

It is a video game. Have you ever heard of Duke Nukem? I would just enter the cheat code "God mode" and blast all the bad guys.

You might have a slight advantage over a knife sure, but what if the person has a gun?

God mode.

It is bluster. Knife or gun, reality does not give one fuck about your good intent. Constant training is what increases the survival of a stressful event, not the weapon itself.

I have honed my skilz on video games.

I think you should value more situational conflict training more than defaulting to use of a weapon of any kind. People also survive by deescalation and fleeing. Your brain, regardless is your most important tool. 

Not with God mode. I can do what I want.

Even outside the issue of guns, any sane lifeguard will tell you, TRAINING is what increases the chance, not only of your own survival, but also of the victim you are trying to save. 

I ain't playing in a pool.

Having a gun is not a utopia. It matters far more how you respond to stress, not the weapon you are facing. 

It is a utopia. When I hold it in my hand I feel the power of greyskull.

"I'm not going down without a fight" is Hollywood crap. Survival even with other life is adaptation, not always brawn or force.

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I have to think about my honor. A Thundercat never runs from Mumra.

KUSA, I grew up with nothing but bullies on my street. You'd be one of those guys who'd say "The only thing they understand is a fight". Not true, even when I did fight back, I got my ass kicked.

You should have made a superhero suit and kicked their ass.

That is more understandable as a kid. But as an adult you cant think like John Wayne or Dirty Harry or play street lawyer with a weapon.

I play John Holmes on the street.

I have avoided being robbed as an adult TWICE in my life without using a fire arm. I have also avoided being assaulted without a firearm as an adult. The reason I did, was situational awareness, remaining calm, and looking for the path of least resistance. Talk is cheap, and the ones who brag about being a hero are the ones most likely to be the first to get hurt.

So you have ninja skilz.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

It's just part of the culture I suppose. There are a lot of people here who like to go shooting/hunting as a hobby, also people here like the idea of freedom from the government and they feel it is their right to own guns if they want to.

And before the gun industry bought the NRA people accepted restrictions on guns like everything else. But the people who stood to make the most money on guns realized they could stampede people with a FUD campaign of epic scale. Now they don't even have to do that, their target (no pun intended) audience is dancing to the music when the band isn't playing.