An unhinged mob

[Amarok]

So, you're saying if they are violent, it's then okay to be violent, which is exactly what I said. I said it's NOT okay to be violent first, which is what you initially negated, so I have no idea what you're going on about.

My point is by example 

Let's say the proud boys are going to hold a hate rally and preach violence against minorities and make a ruckus .I'm saying we have the right to disrupt it and beat the snot out of them because there a bunch of bigot thugs . Technically were starting the physical violence even though their preaching threatening and condoning violence and lastly i'm saying you can no more reason with their kind then you can a fanatical cult thus violence is justified

[Shell B]

So, I definitely completely disagree with you. You're condoning violence right now, and I'm not justified in beating the tar of out of you for it. That's not how it works. That's like saying if someone says, "I'm into rape," shitty as that statement is, you can then go out and rape them and it doesn't matter because they condoned rape. Nah, guy.

[Amarok]

So, I definitely completely disagree with you. You're condoning violence right now, and I'm not justified in beating the tar of out of you for it. That's not how it works. That's like saying if someone says, "I'm into rape," shitty as that statement is, you can then go out and rape them and it doesn't matter because they condoned rape. Nah, guy.

Too bad there is a difference their violence sees the systematic oppression of minorities mine simple stops them from doing it . And your analogy fails as their is a difference between using violence to prevent oppression and raping a rape advocate . Seriously their is the matter of context of what the act is being used to achieve.

[Crossless2.0]

So, you're saying if they are violent, it's then okay to be violent, which is exactly what I said. I said it's NOT okay to be violent first, which is what you initially negated, so I have no idea what you're going on about.

My point is by example 

Let's say the proud boys are going to hold a hate rally and preach violence against minorities and make a ruckus .I'm saying we have the right to disrupt it and beat the snot out of them because there a bunch of bigot thugs . Technically were starting the physical violence even though their preaching threatening and condoning violence and lastly i'm saying you can no more reason with their kind then you can a fanatical cult thus violence is justified

You have a right to peacefully counter-protest the Proud Boys. You have a right to allow them to make complete asses of themselves for the whole world to see. You have a right to defend yourself if attacked by them, or by anyone else.

You also have a right to legal representation and a fair trial after you've been arrested for attacking them, if that's your choice.

A few questions:

1) Given the victim narrative the right is peddling (complete with violent left-wing "mobs"), why would you take actions that lend credibility to their claims? Even if it's true, as you say, that "their kind" can't be reasoned with, isn't there a larger PR struggle that demands discipline on the part of those who oppose the Proud Boys and similar groups? Isn't it possible to uphold First Amendment rights and speak out forcefully against anti-democratic elements without resorting to the very thing you seem to oppose?

2) Would you be willing to pay the price (fines, jail time, civil suits) for your act of violence, or would you seriously try to argue in court that your actions were legally justified? And if justified, on what would you base your claim?

[LastPoet]

My point is by example 

Let's say the proud boys are going to hold a hate rally and preach violence against minorities and make a ruckus .I'm saying we have the right to disrupt it and beat the snot out of them because there a bunch of bigot thugs . Technically were starting the physical violence even though their preaching threatening and condoning violence and lastly i'm saying you can no more reason with their kind then you can a fanatical cult thus violence is justified

So, you would enact violence when only words are thrown to you?

[Amarok]

My point is by example 

Let's say the proud boys are going to hold a hate rally and preach violence against minorities and make a ruckus .I'm saying we have the right to disrupt it and beat the snot out of them because there a bunch of bigot thugs . Technically were starting the physical violence even though their preaching threatening and condoning violence and lastly i'm saying you can no more reason with their kind then you can a fanatical cult thus violence is justified

You have a right to peacefully counter-protest the Proud Boys. You have a right to allow them to make complete asses of themselves for the whole world to see. You have a right to defend yourself if attacked by them, or by anyone else.

You also have a right to legal representation and a fair trial after you've been arrested for attacking them, if that's your choice.

A few questions:

1) Given the victim narrative the right is peddling (complete with violent left-wing "mobs"), why would you take actions that lend credibility to their claims? Even if it's true, as you say, that "their kind" can't be reasoned with, isn't there a larger PR struggle that demands discipline on the part of those who oppose the Proud Boys and similar groups? Isn't it possible to uphold First Amendment rights and speak out forcefully against anti-democratic elements without resorting to the very thing you seem to oppose?

2) Would you be willing to pay the price (fines, jail time, civil suits) for your act of violence, or would you seriously try to argue in court that your actions were legally justified? And if justified, on what would you base your claim?

To answer your questions 

A. I don't much care for their victim hood as they are not victims 

B.Optics is secondary to be as anyone who thinks the Proud Boys are just a bunch of nice guys is ignorant   

C. their is difference between the end goal .Were not resorting as our reasons for doing it are totally different 

2.Of course you should be fined or go to jail . You broke the law even if it was for a just cause i'm not advocating lawlessness

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My point is by example 

Let's say the proud boys are going to hold a hate rally and preach violence against minorities and make a ruckus .I'm saying we have the right to disrupt it and beat the snot out of them because there a bunch of bigot thugs . Technically were starting the physical violence even though their preaching threatening and condoning violence and lastly i'm saying you can no more reason with their kind then you can a fanatical cult thus violence is justified

So, you would enact violence when only words are thrown to you?

I would use violence against those advocating policies that would see certain groups mistreated . Like the forcible removal of non whites from a area as The proud boys have advocated or when they tried to intimidate a Gay village into shouting down in Montreal by rallying there .

[Crossless2.0]

Who the fuck ever suggested the Proud Boys are a bunch of nice guys?!?

[LastPoet]

I would use violence against those advocating policies that would see certain groups mistreated . Like the forcible removal of non whites from a area as The proud boys have advocated  or when they tried to intimidate a Gay village into shouting down in Montreal by rallying there .

Then I guess I overestimated you.

[Amarok]

Who the fuck ever suggested the Proud Boys are a bunch of nice guys?!?

On this forum nobody and i was not implying people were .

In the general public themselves and some of the right wing group they associate with have tried to white wash their image to make them more mainstream .

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I would use violence against those advocating policies that would see certain groups mistreated . Like the forcible removal of non whites from a area as The proud boys have advocated  or when they tried to intimidate a Gay village into shouting down in Montreal by rallying there .

Then I guess I overestimated you.

Your entitled to that belief . But i won't sit back and let them get away with that shit .

[Shell B]

Okay, tough guy.