My Revelation

[Silver]

It's a stupid question, because depending on the individual any non-physical attribute can constitute a man. That's the whole point.

[Angrboda]

Depends on the the metric for what constitutes a great baseball player.

In the case of gender, depends on what society uses as a metric for determining gender. The problem is that it's proven to be far more complex than just looking at one or two binary variables. We don't know what the characteristics exactly are of being a man, but we can all make observations that show it can't just simply be about genitals or chromosomes, and that environmental factors do play some part as well, however it does it.

If you can't come up with one non-physical characteristic of a man, then you have absolutely no evidence to support this claim.

I believe LadyForCamus already gave an answer.

https://atheistforums.org/thread-65176-p...pid2156179

[GrandizerII]

Depends on the the metric for what constitutes a great baseball player.

In the case of gender, depends on what society uses as a metric for determining gender. The problem is that it's proven to be far more complex than just looking at one or two binary variables. We don't know what the characteristics exactly are of being a man, but we can all make observations that show it can't just simply be about genitals or chromosomes, and that environmental factors do play some part as well, however it does it.

If you can't come up with one non-physical characteristic of a man, then you have absolutely no evidence to support this claim.

I didn't say I can't come up with one potential non-physical characteristic of a man. If society deems you as a man based on various factors, that itself could be a non-biological characteristic. So if that's your only challenge to bring to the table, it's been answered here and elsewhere multiple times.

Combine that with other thing I've been saying multiple times (which you haven't bothered much to address), and you can't find a good solid basis to show why a transman cannot be a man.

If you can't agree, great. What is a man, Lek?

[Lek]

It's a stupid question, because depending on the individual any non-physical attribute can constitute a man. That's the whole point.

Can you think of any attributes other than physical that apply to.being a man? I'm not asking about others. Please answer for yourself.

[Silver]

I just answered you. Now use your satan-given critical thinking skills to stop being so piously obtuse.

[GrandizerII]

It's a stupid question, because depending on the individual any non-physical attribute can constitute a man. That's the whole point.

Can you think of any attributes other than physical that apply to.being a man?  I'm not asking about others.  Please  answer for yourself.

I'm sure you've seen this persn before in the media:



This person is a transman. What's more reasonable here to say? That he's a man or woman.

Should we still force him to go to the women's toilets instead of men's at this point?

[Lek]

I just answered you. Now use your satan-given critical thinking skills to stop being so piously obtuse.

Ok. I'll leave you with this. I think you and I share the desire to help people with gender dysphoria. Now I am intimate with alcoholics in recovery. As long as an alcoholic thinks he doesn't have a problem, he will continue to drink. He must first accept that he is an alcoholic. An alcoholic can stop drinking, but he is always an alcoholic

Many times they think they've beaten the problem and they believe they are longer alcoholics. The problem is, that's not the truth. They take a drink and they're right back where they began. It's only when they realize the truth that they can deal with the problem. He is an alcoholic, but he has the power to live a normal life. I wouldn't want to go along with him and urge him to drink.

A woman who has gender Dysphoria can accept their problem and if she wants to she act and appear as a man. She should not be deluded into believing she is really a man. That's why I fight for truth. It leads to problems on society such as biological men competing in women's sports, along with use of bathrooms and locker room for the opposite sex etc. If you're going to deal with a problem, you must first accept the facts concerning the problem.

[Ravenshire]

You are incorrect, by convoluting the concept by comparing the skills earned in being a baseball player with the mindset of identity.

And your mistake is considering identity a mindset. That is a personality trait, essentially conflating some individuals' personality traits with a social category. When it comes to identity, its validity has nothing to do with how one sees oneself. All that matters, from an identity point of view is how other people see each other. You cannot take the social part out of what gender proponents have said for decades are socially constructed categories.

Do you allow others to define you?

I'll bet you don't. Not in any real or meaningful way.

[Silver]

Your comparisons need work. Come back when you've proven you can overcome the self-constructed obstacles in your way.

[Ravenshire]

You are incorrect, by convoluting the concept by comparing the skills earned in being a baseball player with the mindset of identity.

Oh com'on. Atheists won't believe in God unless it can be proven.  You guys want hard evidence. You won't believe in something without the hard evidence.  Not only can they offer no evidence, they can't even give you the slightest definition of what it is in the first place. And you folks aid them in this charade. You should be ashamed. The way to get through a situation is not to pretend it doesn't exist. You're lying to these people in need.

I'm a parent to a non-binary kid. They are in no fucking need from the likes of you or anyone else. Kindly go fuck yourself, with a cactus, sideways if it'll fit!