Today I was speaking to someone that I didn't know at the time was a Christian, really more of a deist but identifies themselves as a Christian. They saw me reading Death From The Skies! so she struck up a conversation about cosmology. She seemed intelligent and our conversation ran from big bang theory, nucleosynthesis to evolution. To make a long story short she said she had an extremely hard time believing any of those because they all violate the second law of thermodynamics due to an increase of entropy seen as an ordering of the system. That was my second hint that she really didn't know much regarding science (first one was her thinking those three theories were wrong). I let her go on for three reasons, the first was I was at a diner and really had no pressing engagements (cause my social life sucks at the moment), I never heard an argument from her view before (from the second law yes but never based on entropy), and the final reason was a selfish one since I found her quite attractive. I let her go on without interrupting her diatribe although I was chomping at the bit.
Finally when she was finished I told her that the second law is only applicable to a closed system not an open one and further the second law is not written in concrete (quickly she objected and asked me, actually taunted me, for an example) and the definition she used of entropy as disorder is incorrect.
She agreed. much to my surprise, that the second law applies to closed and not open systems but her claim is that the universe as a whole is a closed system. She had an argument regarding my statement that the second law wasn't written in concrete and she insisted I provide her with an example. She also said while entropy as disorder isn't a "rigorous" definition it was still valid. I asked her if I could answer her two objections together. She said yes so I did and the visual I gave her left her speechless.
I told her entropy is defined phenomenologically (she didn't know the definition of that word - another non-suprise) as something that always increases or remains constant in a closed system. A more scientific definition from statistical mechanics is that entropy is the statistical behavior of the microscopic components of the system. There is no requirement in the definition that entropy can't decrease. Basically, the increase of entropy is because there are more ways for a system to be high entropy then low yet the low entropy state is not forbidden by the second law. It seemed like her head was starting to swim so being at a diner I showed her my little visual. My water glass was about half full so I poured some oil in it then mixed the whole glass till it was a really disgusting looking mixture. I asked the lady what was the entropy/disorder of that system and like a good little lady she answered it was high. I asked her what would happen if we let the glass sit. She looked like a ghost and said "looks like I was wrong."
Technically I could have been burned (sort of) with the visual I used sine a mixture of oil and water is a low entropy state but highly disordered and the state of them in separate layers is higher entropy but much less disorder.
Anyway, I just thought you guys should be aware that a new Christian/theist argument from entropy is running around.
Finally when she was finished I told her that the second law is only applicable to a closed system not an open one and further the second law is not written in concrete (quickly she objected and asked me, actually taunted me, for an example) and the definition she used of entropy as disorder is incorrect.
She agreed. much to my surprise, that the second law applies to closed and not open systems but her claim is that the universe as a whole is a closed system. She had an argument regarding my statement that the second law wasn't written in concrete and she insisted I provide her with an example. She also said while entropy as disorder isn't a "rigorous" definition it was still valid. I asked her if I could answer her two objections together. She said yes so I did and the visual I gave her left her speechless.
I told her entropy is defined phenomenologically (she didn't know the definition of that word - another non-suprise) as something that always increases or remains constant in a closed system. A more scientific definition from statistical mechanics is that entropy is the statistical behavior of the microscopic components of the system. There is no requirement in the definition that entropy can't decrease. Basically, the increase of entropy is because there are more ways for a system to be high entropy then low yet the low entropy state is not forbidden by the second law. It seemed like her head was starting to swim so being at a diner I showed her my little visual. My water glass was about half full so I poured some oil in it then mixed the whole glass till it was a really disgusting looking mixture. I asked the lady what was the entropy/disorder of that system and like a good little lady she answered it was high. I asked her what would happen if we let the glass sit. She looked like a ghost and said "looks like I was wrong."
Technically I could have been burned (sort of) with the visual I used sine a mixture of oil and water is a low entropy state but highly disordered and the state of them in separate layers is higher entropy but much less disorder.
Anyway, I just thought you guys should be aware that a new Christian/theist argument from entropy is running around.
![[Image: mybannerglitter06eee094.gif]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=i118.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fo112%2Fpussinboots_photos%2FBikes%2Fmybannerglitter06eee094.gif)
Way to go Phil!!
