Atheists are miserable.

[genkaus]

If one drinks a whole bottle of port and still remembers what one's so sad about, then one is clinically depressed.

Or a really heavy-weight drinker.

[LastPoet]

Yep, still doesn't make my statement less true

[kılıç_mehmet]

Has it ever occurred to your 13th century mind that western yoke was not imposed because arabs and turks were not united. Western yoke was imposed because the western world was, and continues to be, better and more systematic at modern science and its application, and clearheaded and innovative in modern economics, and more purposefully ruthless in politics than your tribe.

The western yoke was not even imposed upon us.
It was imposed upon the arabs, who have allied themselves with the westerners against us. They have dug in their own graves.
Besides, if the western world was so great, why have they not been able to "liberate" their brethren in Anatolia?
You lost your foothold in Asia. We gained footholds in Europa.

So in effect, western yoke is imposed because you suck in things that counts. You can fantasize about being united all you want. Being united is not the problem. You will suck together or separately. The fact that you still fantasize about the 14th century "chingess" khan when the world has passed you by and gone to the moon shows just how irredeemably you suck.

Well, that is your opinion. I know that we're bound to do great things when we're united. History shows this.

Those who don't suck as badly and as inveterately as you do, like the Japanese and Chinese, generally tend to gradually figure out what counts, and join the rank of the yokers, instead of bleeting idiotic tribalist fantasy while remaining yoked like the cattles you are.

We know what really counts. What counts is our independence. Nothing else. Without that, nothing really matters. Japan, Korea or China, those are people who are still dependant on the west. Once they oust the US bases out of their lands, and shun the foreigner, just as their forefathers had done, they will become much much greater than ever before.
That is what we will do.

@ kilic=And you call US (meaning "The Westies Atheists") miserable? Man we are so laughing at you

The one laughs last, laughs best, friend.

Uh, no. Nobody with even a modicum of rationality does that. Personally, I live for self-creation, not for sucking the dick of some tribal faction or nation-state like you seem so proud of doing.

Stop denying yourself, hayk.
Have you not said this:

So what you're telling me is, the Turks can come in and invade a region that isn't their own, commit genocide, and it's all just a "clash of ideals"? I guess you could say that if you define Armenia's ideals as surviving free of Turkish occupation, then yeah.

Also, that's not "Eastern Anatolia"; they're the Armenian Highlands. Get your geography correct.

You diaspora armos are the real cocksuckers here.

It's irrational and immoral and no, I do not do the same.

Oh, it is immoral that I work for the wellbeing of my own as a first priority, okay.
I guess you would rather feed the neighbor's kids first before feeding your own kids.
It's immoral to take care of your own family.

So, let's get this straight - even with the knowledge that unification would raise your collective worth, you people are still not united? Wow, you must be even more worthless than I previously thought.

Well, with your simple way of thinking, there can be no unification in the first place.
Obviously, you need to sort out various things that will aid in the formation of Turan. This cannot be done overnight.
Our worth is above the worth of the world, friend. The world will get to know peace through us.

And would replace it with a Turkic yoke on the world.

Why should I?
Do I need your servitude?
We are already living on an area where we have everything we need.

You are deluding yourself if you think that if your nation rose to power it would somehow take the altruistic route and work for the betterment of everyone else.

If so, why do you shun me for thinking otherwise?
Why should I not want my nation to be empowered? After it's unification, we will work towards things that could benefit everyone, but first, and foremost, one must only work towards his own national goals!
You are fools if you cannot understand this. This leftist-humanistic crap has melted your brains.

You would do as the west does: Business before pleasure before charity

Well, not to ourselves. A Turkist form of thought takes the social progress of the Turkish society as the fist and foremost goal for advancement.
The capitalist agenda is what drives people to be pragmatists, cosmopolitanists. I know that you all oppose these things but just support them to oppose me.

very many in the western world who frown upon our own imperialistic ways

Well, it really is not my place to tell you to frown upon something.
I do not tell anyone to frown upon anything. I am not interested in what the west thinks about the rest of the world. I am interested in our own future, but if the west is determined to get in our way, they will hit a wall, just like they did during our war for independence. We Turks have still not realized that we need to be together to survive.

And that, THAT is why a Turkic superpower would be a horrible thing if it were realized in your image; because when someone believes their ideology over everyone else, they will not stop at their own borders with it.

Well, we only want our own "borders". Our real borders. Things that are rightfully ours. We do not eye the lands of Greece, not the lands of Syria, or Georgia. We want our own lands. We want to live with our own people. I don't know what is so hard to understand about this one.

After all, you continually make analogies to the huns and turks and how they basically dominated a huge chunk of the world through military action.

Yes, we have. But this was the way things were done back then.
It was both a blessing and a mistake, actually. We've created a larger lebensraum, while fracturing ourselves. Now, we just need to unite, and live in this lebensraum we've created for ourselves.

You and your kind, trusted with superpower status?

We do not need your trust.

that you talk up your barbarian ancestors who were well-known for their rape and murder sprees as they burned and razed cities, yet then decry the instantaneous snuffing of civilian lives from bombs.

Okay. Now let's look at your archivements. Two world wars, and you're still going on. Two atom bombs, and you're still waving around with nukes.
We're peaceful, as long as others are.
You're on the other hand, are not. For you lack "inner peace". You're constantly afraid.

Where your barbaric ancestors basically rode into the towns, burned EVERYTHING and killed or enslaved as many as they could, we at least TRIED to show restraint, and for the most part, succeeded.

Well, I guess our barbaric ancestors were on par with your barbaric ancestors, the vikings.

Obviously, there were accidents, and there were a few men who lost sight of their morals and values and took to murder themselves but on the vast major whole we were not, and when it happened, there was remorse.

Show this remorse and mercy to yourselves first, for we do not need your remorse. We just need eachother.
Anything or anyone else is really trivial.

And as you show, there is no remorse from your ancestors for their actions, not even from their descendants.

What? You want me to go down on my knees, cry, beg and throw you money?
Fuck you. I am proud of my ancestors as ever. We did what we had to do, you did what you had to do. It's not me who is constantly talking about leftism, socialism and etc. around here.

You may talk up the "worth of unity" and of "overthrowing the yoke of the west" all you like,

Yes, and I will continue to do so.
No matter whether you call us barbaric, worthless or whatever, I know our worth from the fact that we're still here. Not even your crusades were able to drive us back. The west, christianity, and the european race have been unsuccessful in driving back the turanoid influence in the world.
All the while you have no real presence left anywhere else in the east, but in lands where you've faced natives armed with sticks and stones.
What great victories, yes? We've faced the might of the two roman empires, and swallowed one entirely, and held the east in our hand for centuries.
Our greatness cannot be measured in terms of your ways of thought.
Chuck looks at things from the ways that things work out today. His mind is still riddled with the filth of multiculturalist agenda, cosmopolitanism and humanism.

You have no worth. Nothing notable to contribute to the world. And therefore you have no leverage. Until you have leverage, you have a hollow cause.

We do not really have the intention to contribute anything to the world. We never had. Obviously, we contribute to ourselves first. Our greatest contribution was to secure a landmass on which we could thrive. We've managed to do so. Now, we will continue to contribute to ourselves by first securing our technological independence.
Our cause is never "hollow", for there are people who strive to fulfill it.
And as I said, our worth is not measured by your dollars. I do not measure my worth by comparing myself to any of you. I measure my worth by comparing myself to Mehmed the conqueror, Alp Arslan, Chingiss Khan, and many others who have shaken the foundations of this world. I must rival them in how I manage to further the greatness of my people.
Of course, as a scientist, I must compare myself to people who have contributed to my field of science. I must rival them in how I manage to further my scientific knowledge in the arts of engineering.

[genkaus]

Oh, it is immoral that I work for the wellbeing of my own as a first priority, okay.
I guess you would rather feed the neighbor's kids first before feeding your own kids.
It's immoral to take care of your own family.

No, you depraved fool, what is immoral is letting your family/tribe/country be the measure of your worth.

[Tobie]

Really mehmet, you're stealing ideas and terms from the nazis now? What makes you think your agenda will enjoy any more success than their's did?

[Hovik]

You diaspora armos are the real cocksuckers here.

Except I'm not Armenian, you moron. You assumed that.

[Annik]

Really mehmet, you're stealing ideas and terms from the nazis now? What makes you think your agenda will enjoy any more success than their's did?

Nationalism is nationalism. It's easy to justify the slaughter of thousands, warmonger and control your people when you make your nation practically into a religion.

Except I'm not Armenian, you moron. You assumed that.

You red-headed, German wonder.

[kılıç_mehmet]

Oh, it is immoral that I work for the wellbeing of my own as a first priority, okay.
I guess you would rather feed the neighbor's kids first before feeding your own kids.
It's immoral to take care of your own family.

No, you depraved fool, what is immoral is letting your family/tribe/country be the measure of your worth.

But your family is actually a measure of your worth. Are you not what your parents raise you to be? Perhaps, you might have a few differences in things like politics and etc, but your family has defined what you are.
And well, you obviously hold your own family in high regards above everyone else. I sure do.
Only those, whose family ties are weak and whose parents are of less worth, produce children of even lesser worth. Those on the other hand, do not really put much value on their own family. They look for something else, another family. They even sometimes run away from their homes, or are just left to fend off for themselves.

Our family is our worth, friend. Outside of my parents, who too, are people that have defined my current worth, my largest family, the Turkic world, is what defines my worth, friend.

Really mehmet, you're stealing ideas and terms from the nazis now? What makes you think your agenda will enjoy any more success than their's did?

Tell me which ideas I have supposedly stolen from the nazis?
Besides, our agenda is not dictated by the self-centered delusions of a single man. Our ideals are a collective of the many writings, books and deeds of known Turkish writers, statesmen, heroes and military leaders.
What will define their success is that it is a native idea. It was shaped according to us. We do not need to shape ourselves according to it.
Communism, nazism, fascism, socialism, capitalism and etc. all are foreign ideologies, none have any relevance to our society.

Except I'm not Armenian, you moron. You assumed that.

I didn't assume that, I know it.

Nationalism is nationalism. It's easy to justify the slaughter of thousands, warmonger and control your people when you make your nation practically into a religion.

Certainly you know nothing of nationalism. It's certainly a lot easier to kill thousands with democracy(as in the case of Vietnam, Korea, Iraq and Afghanistan) than with Nationalism, yes? The blood of those thousands is not on my hands!

[Hovik]

Certainly you know nothing of nationalism. It's certainly a lot easier to kill thousands with democracy(as in the case of Vietnam, Korea, Iraq and Afghanistan) than with Nationalism, yes? The blood of those thousands is not on my hands!

I'm pretty sure WWI and WWII taught us a whole hell of a lot about the merits of nationalism and how easy it is for it to lead to the deaths of millions (does the Holocaust ring a bell?).

I didn't assume that, I know it.

If I've learned anything from your posts, you don't know shit about anything.

[Tobie]

Tell me which ideas I have supposedly stolen from the nazis?
Besides, our agenda is not dictated by the self-centered delusions of a single man. Our ideals are a collective of the many writings, books and deeds of known Turkish writers, statesmen, heroes and military leaders.
What will define their success is that it is a native idea. It was shaped according to us. We do not need to shape ourselves according to it.
Communism, nazism, fascism, socialism, capitalism and etc. all are foreign ideologies, none have any relevance to our society.

"Lebensraum", which you said in your previous post, is a nazi term for a nazi ideal.

What makes you think a collective delusion is any better or more true than that of one man?