Messages From The Dead

[jupitor]

I have to say in case you missed it that I do not believe in a God or in any of the bible. I have put 'agnostic' because I believe there is an afterlife and that is only because of the weird experiences I have had. I am in no way religious.

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

yes the flesh becomes a piece of meat but the mind/conscience/personality doesn't.

You have made a positive claim, which attracts the burden of proof. Let's see it.


PS the plural of 'anecdote' is neither 'data' nor ' proof' .

You don't know that for sure Downbeat, just as no one else does. You are only surmising.

Actually, there is more convincing evidence for that position than for yours;Eg harm the brain,harm the mind.

There is NO credible evidence that ANYTHING survives death.

By all means believe what you like. However,be prepared to be challenged if you make a truth statement about things which seem to be a personal superstition

In case you didn't realise,this is an atheist forum. That means many of the people here are skeptics,and demand proof of truth claims.

Your claim of survival after deaths is an extraordinary one. As Carl Sagan said "extraordinary claims require extra ordinary evidence"

[jupitor]

My work colleagues were my proof. I wrote the name down in a works diary because they mocked me at the time. A year later when the murderer was arrested, I dug out the diary and there it was, the name of the arrested murderer, just as they had witnessed me write the name down a year previously...oh and a couple of them had done their signature at the side of the name.
I'm aware that this is an atheist board but there are all denominations posting on here. I'm not trying to convince anyone, just relating my experiences. I have gone from Christian to atheist to agnostic. We shouldn't be 'stuck' in our minds about beliefs without researching, looking into things, coming to our own conclusions etc

[Brian37]

My work colleagues were my proof. I wrote the name down in a works diary because they mocked me at the time. A year later when the murderer was arrested, I dug out the diary and there it was, the name of the arrested murderer, just as they had witnessed me write the name down a year previously...oh and a couple of them had done their signature at the side of the name.
I'm aware that this is an atheist board but there are all denominations posting on here. I'm not trying to convince anyone, just relating my experiences. I have gone from Christian to atheist to agnostic. We shouldn't be 'stuck' in our minds about beliefs without researching, looking into things, coming to our own conclusions etc

1. Anecdotal hearsay "just believe me" DOES NOT COUNT. You had prior knowledge or a good "hunch". What you did not do is talk to the dead.

This is the same mental trap people fall for with psychics.

A simple version of this is the "magic trick" of guessing the number in someone's head. I used to know that mental trick myself. It is nothing but fishing and working backwards, but there is no such thing as spirits or talking to the dead.

There is no "research" there are just too many people watching to much cable. There are no ghosts or spirits or entities or super natural, NO SUCH THING.

"Why People Believe Weird Things" Micheal Shermer. Read it.

[jupitor]

You're right, I didn't talk to the dead. The dead passed messages to me, without me saying a word. My partner was the biggest skeptic I have ever encountered until we both encountered a discarnate and we were left an aport to prove it . Too long to relate here but he is no longer a skeptic.

[Brian37]

You're right, I didn't talk to the dead. The dead passed messages to me, without me saying a word. My partner was the biggest skeptic I have ever encountered until we both encountered a discarnate and we were left an aport to prove it . Too long to relate here but he is no longer a skeptic.

No human brain once dead and decayed works. Once you are dead you are dead. You only have a delusion in your own mind. Dead people have never talked to you or anyone ever.

If you really think that, in a VERY REAL literal medical sense, all blasphemy and sarcasm aside, could have a REAL mental condition you need to address.

The natural explanation for your "experience" is that it is a delusion caused by many factors not limited to but could include, stress, chemical imbalance, and or mental illness.

But what did not happen was a dead person talking to you. If you think you hear voices or "see things" , that is you and a brain malfunction. I am not saying that to be mean either.

[jupitor]

No, that's alright Brian, I'm ok with that, it's your opinion. I didn't just hear the murdered girl, she visually appeared, in the dream; took seconds then she disappeared.
I am sound of mind and didn't ask for these messages. I could not possibly have had any knowledge of the murderer's identity at that point. It took a year to find/arrest him. Maybe had the police not been skeptics when I informed them, they'd have picked him up earlier.
Anyway, that was in the 70s and I 'begged' the universe not to use me as it frightened me to death, I didn't want to 'do' supernatural. and so the messages stopped.
I am a very strong person, never had any mental problems, held a high executive position. I can't explain it either but I do not lie. 'Integrity is my middle name'.

[Brian37]

No, that's alright Brian, I'm ok with that, it's your opinion. I didn't just hear the murdered girl, she visually appeared, in the dream; took seconds then she disappeared.
I am sound of mind and didn't ask for these messages. I could not possibly have had any knowledge of the murderer's identity at that point. It took a year to find/arrest him. Maybe had the police not been skeptics when I informed them, they'd have picked him up earlier.
Anyway, that was in the 70s and I 'begged' the universe not to use me as it frightened me to death, I didn't want to 'do' supernatural. and so the messages stopped.
I am a very strong person, never had any mental problems, held a high executive position. I can't explain it either but I do not lie. 'Integrity is my middle name'.

No that is NOT just my opinion, medically speaking the "vision" you say you had was a BRAIN MALFUNCTION which caused the delusion you had and was triggered by NATURAL brain function. No one talked to you or passed a message on to you.

I have "seen" my dead grandmother standing at the foot of my bed. I have "seen" my dead father standing at the foot of my bed. That happened when I was a kid and I did not know any better. But I know now no matter how real it felt, I know know that it was merely my brain doing that.

It is nothing more than your conscious and subconscious mixing, and if you really have stuff like depression, bi polar disorder or just even mere stress it can compile that sensation.

BUT you did not communicate with any dead person. Not knowing how powerful your brain can be in fooling you is what your problem is.

---

And where did I accuse you of lying? Just because I am telling you the truth about what you really went through doesn't make you a lier, just mistaken.

And again, I said you MAY have a mental disorder you may not be aware of. BUT I also said that delusion might have been brought on by mere mundane stress. Stress alone can cause very weird or very frightening dreams, even while awake.

People often have strange our frightening dreams right before or after a stressful event like witnessing a car crash, or worrying about a loved one in the hospital, or an exam in college or job performance. And lots of times the person may not be even consciously aware that they are stressed out. Quite normal but still nothing less than a brain misfire.

[jupitor]

that doesn't explain why I was passed accurate names that I could not possibly have known...i.e... a drug gang leader's name, two forenames and a surname then, a murderer's name, one forename and a surname.
I can understand the brain 'tricking' etc. I have no problem with that but how can names be passed. The brain can't trick me into knowing the likes. But as someone pointed out, this is an atheist board so perhaps I should stop posting.

[Brian37]

that doesn't explain why I was passed accurate names that I could not possibly have known...i.e... a drug gang leader's name, two forenames and a surname then, a murderer's name, one forename and a surname.
I can understand the brain 'tricking' etc. I have no problem with that but how can names be passed. The brain can't trick me into knowing the likes. But as someone pointed out, this is an atheist board so perhaps I should stop posting.

Now here is where I will flat out say you are lying. No one, and I mean NO ONE does that unless they are flat out lying and knew before hand and simply convinced those around them it happened.

You are dishonestly trying to mix real mental issues with flat out con artists.

IF IF IF IF IF you are claiming you came up with the names without prior knowledge you ARE flat out lying. That is nothing but people gaining prior knowledge and not letting the people know how they got it, THAT IS A SCAM and a very dishonest one.

THE OTHER about "seeing" things is a very normal brain misfire. That has happened to me.

And yes you should stop posting because you ARE doing a disservice to people with real mental issues and selling a scam.

We don't mind debate here, but I do hate con artists.