A Small Census

[jstrodel]

Hm. The point went humming over someone's head...

What it your point? Not all members of atheist forums in the year 2012 are 16 point hippies? I don't see how that relates to anything that I have written.


The atheist forum of communication likes to mix mocking and what resembles scientific research. I call this a "cheap shot". Why not just argue your point without relying on tricks, you are trying to say what: there is no connection between atheism and the myriad of liberal/left wing subcultures that formed in the post 1960's era? That isn't true, so you make up a survey to prove that people in 2012 are not all hippies and people were "recruited" into atheism. Ok, well, that proves it.

[Tartarus Sauce]

I am a former leftist. I grew up leftist. My mom believed that George Bush deserved to be executed for the Iraq War. I grew up with all that stuff. I understand there is some truth to it, but the radicalism is scary. I feel like a lot of leftists are ready to start a civil war.

Yes, well I feel like the far right wing nutcases are itching to enshrine their religious beliefs in legislation, a most fundamental violation of the constitution.

This is what I believe: The idea that atheists with no way really to deal with moral skepticism are supposed to use redistribution of wealth to fight a culture war in which they take the public, which is 80% Christian and move the money into wealthy universities to indoctrinate people into atheism and teach them that the way to be a moral person is that they need to reject religion and need to put all of their faith in expanding government programs that directly benefit the atheists.

And your unsubstantiated belief smells like horseshit.

I understand there are legitimate liberal/left wing concerns. But why should leftists have all the political power? Why should they be able to take money from people and use the money to advance a secular state that 80% of America disagrees with?

Are you seriously suggesting that ALL American Christians are against secularism the same way you are? You realize there is a lot of support for secularism among the religious moderates, right? Secularism is for the benefit of everybody who doesn't want the governments and churches forcing a very specific religious doctrine upon the them, which includes ANYONE that isn't a fanatic fundamentalist. The moderate/mainline Christians don't want Christian legislation anymore than atheists do, in fact they wish just as much as I do that people like you would shut up and stop shoving your noses up the personal lives of others. The major push against secularism is from evangelicals who think they have a god-given right to forcefully shove THEIR specific formula of Christianity down everybody's throat. Around 25% of the total American population is identified as evangelical, not even half the percentage of that dishonest, whopping 80%.

Why should public money pay for atheism? The liberals in education fight so vigorously to maintain their choke hold on the minds of the American public, knowing that as long as they control peoples minds they will win elections. They use the public education system to advance atheism, to advance institutionalized censorship of any criticism of homosexuality (even though 80% of America is Christian), they use academia to teach Marxism.

The conservatives in public and private schools fight ferociously to indoctrinate masses of children to be subservient to both the US government and an invisible sky-daddy, while also trying to get an alternative theory of evolution taught as being "science." See how easy it is to throw around unsubstantiated bullshit (although that actually had some truth to it)?

I had a friend of mine growing up who is now in a PhD program. He is openly a Communist (supports Lenin) in a fairly good university. The left will censor Christians in the university who want to criticize homosexuality, but they will allow people who are openly Communist and accept the Soviet Union (not even Marxist, openly Communist).

Oh the humanity, communism!

They are fighting a culture war, they want to increase taxes, they want more power, they want control of America so they can push forward their socialistic agenda, against peoples wills. They know that religion stands in their way, and has stood in the way of left wing goals since the 19th century.

No, people are becoming more lenient in their social attitudes towards topics that have been considered taboo for centuries, the social advancement is progressing a direction that will leave fundamentalist religion in the dust, and therefore, fundies are becoming a movement defined as reactionary. The extremely religious are the ones who are having to surmount the obstacles of current social change, not the liberals. You are right though, you do stand in our way, and by our I mean anybody with half a brain and an open mind, religious or not.

I do not think every aspect of the liberal/leftist view of life is wrong, a lot of it is found in Christianity, but a lot of it is a battle of who is in control and whether people must accept Christian teachings to be accepted in the society they live in. Liberals/leftists are trying to erase social distinctions between the righteous and the wicked and it is scary. The culture of liberalism does not distinguish between good and evil. Sometimes it does not distinguish between good and bad.

More horseshit you are spoon-feeding yourself to fuel your delusions.

I could go on and on and on, if you want more reasons why the left is a dangerous force, not completely wrong about everything, but nonetheless, a dangerous force. I do know some Christians who are socialists, I would not say they are bad people, there have been a fair number through history. But I think if you look at the movement as a whole, it is a dangerous movement.

On the contrary, you have highlighted for everyone the dangers associated with ignorance, intolerance, groupthink, and delusions, the very things that the far right are currently banking on. You are the worst tasting toaster strudel I ever had the misfortune of biting into.

[Kayenneh]

Atheism is a liberal/left wing movement.

No it isn't. Atheism is lack of belief in any gods, you don't need to be political to do that. Politically involved atheists come from all over the spectrum.

If you wanted to have a different question that I think would probably capture the political aspect of the atheist movement more, you could ask "How many people are to the left of Barack Obama".

As I said, not every atheist is into politics and not all here are American, so that question is a redundant one.

But there are also a lot of people who are very young, who are filled with left wing propaganda, and who use drugs. A whole lot of people. If you want to see one, go to a college campus.

This applies to people, not only atheists.

You attempt to caricature my accurate assessment of "the left" as "hippies who listen to psychedelic movement" is a deeply unscientific and methodological flawed approach.

Lighten up, it was just a small survey. Be free to make your own if you find this one lacking.

Consider the pornography question, regardless of how you word your atheist propaganda, they have pornography right on this forum.

Yes, and it's only visible to those who wish to enter. What's so bad about pornography and sex?

You will not see posts on Christian forums about whether it is safe to take ecstasy and what is the correct dose and way to do it, but you see them here.

Your point is? Our members are welcome to discuss any topic as long as it doesn't break any forum rules.

Your survey proves that you want to disprove Christianity more than you want to do real science.

What? How on earth was this survey a way to disprove christianity? And I think rexbeccarox is well aware that this isn't scientific, but a way to gather the opinion of those who frequent this forum.

I think if you don't care that political groups use sex and drugs and atheism to manipulate people, you are not a compassionate person.

Let me fix this quote for you: I think if you don't care that religious groups use brainwashing and scare tactics and faith to manipulate people, you are not a compassionate person.

Atheism is linked to a youthful rebellion and rejection of Christianity that typically happens in high school or college. It is ridiculous to try and place this on all atheists, of course there are many that do not fit into this category.

Wow, you make it really hard for me not to be sarcastic.. You do realize that during high school/college years, the brain develops and people start to get other points of views and influences than the ones they've got at home, so to have a change of heart either way isn't uncommon? You are fond of your generalizations, aren't you?

[Whateverist]

1. What is your age? 60 big ones in the bank, baby.

2. Are you married? Kids? Happily. One stepson. Six when we met; now 37.

3. Are you angry or disappointed at "God"? HELL NO, GAWD DAMMIT!

4. Do you subscribe to hedonism? You mean comfort, pleasure and stimulation? Sure. Or did you mean "is that your one and only motivation in life?" In which case, no.

5. Are you an atheist because you want to be, without eternal consequences, sexually promiscuous? A drug addict? An alcoholic?
I worry about the poor sick twisted soul that would ask such a question.

6. Do you like "psychedelic" music? I did. I like a lot of genres of music.

7. Was atheism "transmitted" to you from a "Marxist"? Sick fuck.

8. Are you selfish? You mean all the time to the extent that I worry that I might not be normal? No.

9. Is your "community" centered around pornography? Weirdo.

10. Is your atheism a political statement? My atheism is a reflection of my agnosticism and complete indifference to questions about gods.

11. Were you recruited into atheism by the promises of sex and drugs? Damn, just how much drugs did you do man? Where do you get these questions? I thought you had been an atheist. Did you ever stop to consider that your depravity back then had more to do with who you are as a person than it did your lack of religion at the time?

---

If you wanted to have a different question that I think would probably capture the political aspect of the atheist movement more, you could ask "How many people are to the left of Barack Obama".

Tell you what. You answer the 11 questions honestly yourself and I'll be happy to answer this one, or a short list of your own questions if you can trim it down the way Rebecca did.

---

I bet around 40% of the atheists in America are political radicals.

You know, 63% of statistics are made up on the fly.

Can I get this framed?

[downbeatplumb]

[quote='rexbeccarox' pid='410881' dateline='1362683890']


1. What is your age?

44

2. Are you married? Kids?

Married, three kids

3. Are you angry or disappointed at "God"?

That would just be silly, there is no god as far as I know.

4. Do you subscribe to hedonism?

I'd like to but my wife wont let me.

5. Are you an atheist because you want to be, without eternal consequences, sexually promiscuous? A drug addict? An alcoholic?

I am atheist because the idea of a theistic god is rather silly.

6. Do you like "psychedelic" music?

No I do not.
I don't like lots of different kinds of music.
The worst has to be country and western and whatever that shit Mumford and son play is.

7. Was atheism "transmitted" to you from a "Marxist"?

I was born not believing and just carried on.

8. Are you selfish?

Isn't everyone to some extent.
I do give to charity regularly and do the best for my loved ones.

9. Is your "community" centered around pornography?

No.

10. Is your atheism a political statement?

No.

11. Were you recruited into atheism by the promises of sex and drugs?

Does his happen!
Anyway I thought it was religions that worked this way. Flirty fishers and all that.

[Whateverist]

4. Do you subscribe to hedonism?

I'd like to but my wife wont let me.


7. Was atheism "transmitted" to you from a "Marxist"?

I was born not believing and just carried on.
ted into atheism by the promises of sex and drugs?

I would award you a kudo for each of these but that doesn't seem to be an option. #7 - lolling my ass off.

[Kayenneh]

The worst has to be country and western and whatever that shit Mumford and son play is.

Noooo..! We can't be friends anymore!

[downbeatplumb]

The worst has to be country and western and whatever that shit Mumford and son play is.

Noooo..! We can't be friends anymore!

So what are you into Dolly Parton?

[Kayenneh]

So what are you into Dolly Parton?

Nah, I agree that country isn't music, but I do like Mumford and sons..

(I know, I should be ashamed, and I am)

[TromboneAtheist]

1. What is your age? 14

2. Are you married? Kids? Nope

3. Are you angry or disappointed at "God"? Not really. Not his fault he doesn't exist.

4. Do you subscribe to hedonism? I don't have A problem with it, as long as it does not hurt others.

5. Are you an atheist because you want to be, without eternal consequences, sexually promiscuous? A drug addict? An alcoholic? In a nutshell, no. I have no desire to do or be any of those things.

6. Do you like "psychedelic" music? I'll just go with no.

7. Was atheism "transmitted" to you from a "Marxist"? Definitely not.

8. Are you selfish? Of course. I try to keep it to a minimum though.

9. Is your "community" centered around pornography? Nope.

10. Is your atheism a political statement? Nope.

11. Were you recruited into atheism by the promises of sex and drugs? Nope. I wasn't recruited.