Bible prophecies

[Crossless2.0]

Actually - A BIG ONE - told supposedly by the christ

He said that the way to tell a false Prophet who says something that does not come true - he should be ignored

The christ also said that there would be some people in his audience that would not die before he would return in GLORY -

Certainly his claimed resurrection had not glory - it did not fulfill the messiah prophecies - there is NOT a single mention of it in the historical record of that time - and such glory would be widely known and reported.

And today - there is NOT a single person from that era that is still alive


So the christ was a false prophet.

*Cue arbitrary interpretations of Gospels and references to 2 Peter*

[Brian37]

To answer the title of the thread. NO, absolutely no holy book of any religion has any power of prediction. It is retrofitting ambiguous words to an event after the fact.

"Prophecy" works just like Horoscopes. Take 12 general events and or descriptions that can apply to anyone, remove the zodiac signs, stick them in a hat, mix them up, and people will apply it to themselves even if it does not match the month,

No different than fortune cookies.

All bullshit.

[orangebox21]

So, why do you think that the generation of whom Jesus was speaking to is the one He was speaking of?

Context.

Did the generation He was speaking to witness the things He was speaking of? (Matt 24:29-34)

And why does the 'some here who will not taste death' refer to the 'generation who will not pass until all these things are fulfilled'?

Because it makes sense in light of the explanation that Jesus believed the kingdom of God was imminent and that once it came, there would no longer be death.

I don't fully understand what you mean. If you don't mind I'd like a little further explanation here.

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So, why do you think that the generation of whom Jesus was speaking to is the one He was speaking of? And why does the 'some here who will not taste death' refer to the 'generation who will not pass until all these things are fulfilled'?

Well simply because the rest of us have a solid grasp on the English language and what the words that are written mean.
What you're saying is like Jesus holding up a speckled green fish and talking about the fish and describing it's color as speckled green and then when he's not around trying to tell everyone that he wasn't talking about the fish he was holding. I mean you can't really think that anyone with an ounce of intelligence is going to swallow this bit of horse shit you're attempting to sell can you???

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[The Valkyrie]

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Context.

Did the generation He was speaking to witness the things He was speaking of? (Matt 24:29-34)

Because it makes sense in light of the explanation that Jesus believed the kingdom of God was imminent and that once it came, there would no longer be death.

I don't fully understand what you mean. If you don't mind I'd like a little further explanation here.

[Hide]
Well simply because the rest of us have a solid grasp on the English language and what the words that are written mean.
What you're saying is like Jesus holding up a speckled green fish and talking about the fish and describing it's color as speckled green and then when he's not around trying to tell everyone that he wasn't talking about the fish he was holding. I mean you can't really think that anyone with an ounce of intelligence is going to swallow this bit of horse shit you're attempting to sell can you???

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Nope. I'm saying that the generation Jesus was speaking to is not the generation He was speaking of. To fit your analogy to your argument, the crowd He'd be speaking to would be reflected by the content of the speech. In this case the content is defined as the characteristics of the fish He was describing (speckled green). So according to your argument the crowd would all have to be fish, and speckled green. To fit my argument He'd be speaking to a crowd about a fish and the crowd would not be reflected by the content of the speech (they wouldn't be fish, or speckled green). Your analogy actually supports my argument.

Furthermore, it happens all the time in normal conversation that the person we are speaking to is not the person we are speaking about.

Because when people say "this generation" they mean their own generation or at the very most the people living at the time "this generation" is said.

I was having a conversation with a historian. He said to me: "In the Late Middle Ages (1340–1400) Europe experienced the most deadly disease outbreak in history when the Black Death, the infamous pandemic of bubonic plague, hit in 1347, killing a third of the human population. It is believed that this generation subsequently became more violent as the mass mortality rate cheapened life and thus increased warfare, crime, popular revolt, waves of flagellants, and persecution." (this is a fictional conversation used as an illustration, facts taken from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bubonic_pl...t_outbreak)

Is the historian speaking of his generation as the one that experienced the Black death?

The christ also said that there would be some people in his audience that would not die before he would return in GLORY -

To what scripture passage are you referring?

Certainly his claimed resurrection had not glory - it did not fulfill the messiah prophecies -

Is your position that because Christ did not fulfill all the messianic prophecies prior to His crucifixion His resurrection had not glory?

there is NOT a single mention of it in the historical record of that time - and such glory would be widely known and reported.

[/hide]
I can think of at least four historical records of that time that mention it.
And those are?

[GrandizerII]

Context.

Did the generation He was speaking to witness the things He was speaking of? (Matt 24:29-34)

No, which is exactly why his prediction was a failure.

Because it makes sense in light of the explanation that Jesus believed the kingdom of God was imminent and that once it came, there would no longer be death.

I don't fully understand what you mean. If you don't mind I'd like a little further explanation here.

Jesus preached that the kingdom of God was near, right? And once it came, do you think he believed any of his followers who were still alive then would have still tasted death even after the kingdom of God had come already? Isn't the whole kingdom of God thing about being immortal and no longer having to fear death?

[Minimalist]

I can think of at least four historical records of that time that mention it.

No, you can't.

[Mudhammam]

Matthew 24 has nothing to do with current events. Jerusalem was trampled by the Romans in 70 A.D. Scholars typically date Matthew anywhere from mid 70 A.D. to the beginning of the second century. Understanding the cultural environment at the time of these writings is key to understanding the context of Jesus' purported words. Anyone who says Jesus is talking about the twentieth century state of Israel is a fucking moron.

[Cinjin]

Nope. I'm saying that the generation Jesus was speaking to is not the generation He was speaking of. To fit your analogy to your argument, the crowd He'd be speaking to would be reflected by the content of the speech. In this case the content is defined as the characteristics of the fish He was describing (speckled green). So according to your argument the crowd would all have to be fish, and speckled green. To fit my argument He'd be speaking to a crowd about a fish and the crowd would not be reflected by the content of the speech (they wouldn't be fish, or speckled green). Your analogy actually supports my argument.

Furthermore, it happens all the time in normal conversation that the person we are speaking to is not the person we are speaking about.

Ok, I'm not going to bother with the fact that you completely missed the point or that your response is an apologist's attempt at misdirection. Instead I'll go with what your Bible says and see where we get.

Matthew 16:27, 28
“For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels,
and will then repay every man according to his deeds. Truly I say to you, there
are some of those who are standing here who will not taste deathuntil they see
the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.“

Matthew 24:32-34
[i]Now learn the parable from the fig tree: when its branch has already become
tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near; so, you too,
when you see all these things, recognize that He is near, right at the door.
Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.“ [/i]

Mark 13:29-30
Even so, you too, when you see these things happening, recognize that He is near,
right at the door. Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place…“

Hebrews 1:1-2
“Long ago, at many times and in many ways, God spoke to our fathers
by the prophets, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son…”

1 Corinthians 10:11
“Now these things happened to them as an example, but they were written
down for our instruction, on whom the end of the ages has come.”

1 John 2:18
“Children, it is the last hour, and as you have heard that antichrist is coming,
so now many antichrists have come. Therefore we know that it is the last hour.”

Revelation 22:6,7,10,12,20
“And he said to me, “These words are faithful and true”; and the Lord, the God of the spirits of the prophets, sent His angel to show to His bond-servants the things which must soon take place. “And behold, I am coming quickly. Blessed is he who heeds the words of the prophecy of this book.” And he said to me, “Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book, for the time is near. Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to render to every man according to what he has done. He who testifies to these things says, “Yes, I am coming quickly.“”…


Notice that Jesus didn’t say “that generation” – which would be the normal way of referring to a future generation. He said “this generation”.
Jesus said that some of his listeners (and the high priest at his trial) would still be alive to see his return to Earth.

So tell me you filthy apologist, what evidence do you have that contradicts your own Bible?

Because right now this is all you've got ...



Now bring some evidence for your claims or shut the fuck up because your Bible doesn't support your unsubstantiated rationalizations simply because you say it does. Rather the polar opposite.

[Jenny A]

Nope. I'm saying that the generation Jesus was speaking to is not the generation He was speaking of. To fit your analogy to your argument, the crowd He'd be speaking to would be reflected by the content of the speech. In this case the content is defined as the characteristics of the fish He was describing (speckled green). So according to your argument the crowd would all have to be fish, and speckled green. To fit my argument He'd be speaking to a crowd about a fish and the crowd would not be reflected by the content of the speech (they wouldn't be fish, or speckled green). Your analogy actually supports my argument.

Furthermore, it happens all the time in normal conversation that the person we are speaking to is not the person we are speaking about.

Yes, if you actually read, and pay attention to the New Testament, the only conclusion is that Jesus and Paul both expected the second coming within the life times of the people they were talking to. Those people have been dead for almost 2000 years. Jesus and Paul were wrong. Game over.

Ok, I'm not going to bother with the fact that you completely missed the point or that your response is an apologist's attempt at misdirection. Instead I'll go with what your Bible says and see where we get.

Matthew 16:27, 28
“For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels,
and will then repay every man according to his deeds. Truly I say to you, there
are some of those who are standing here who will not taste deathuntil they see
the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.“

Matthew 24:32-34
[i]Now learn the parable from the fig tree: when its branch has already become
tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near; so, you too,
when you see all these things, recognize that He is near, right at the door.
Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.“ [/i]

Mark 13:29-30
Even so, you too, when you see these things happening, recognize that He is near,
right at the door. Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place…“

Hebrews 1:1-2
“Long ago, at many times and in many ways, God spoke to our fathers
by the prophets, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son…”

1 Corinthians 10:11
“Now these things happened to them as an example, but they were written
down for our instruction, on whom the end of the ages has come.”

1 John 2:18
“Children, it is the last hour, and as you have heard that antichrist is coming,
so now many antichrists have come. Therefore we know that it is the last hour.”

Revelation 22:6,7,10,12,20
“And he said to me, “These words are faithful and true”; and the Lord, the God of the spirits of the prophets, sent His angel to show to His bond-servants the things which must soon take place. “And behold, I am coming quickly. Blessed is he who heeds the words of the prophecy of this book.” And he said to me, “Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book, for the time is near. Behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to render to every man according to what he has done. He who testifies to these things says, “Yes, I am coming quickly.“”…


Notice that Jesus didn’t say “that generation” – which would be the normal way of referring to a future generation. He said “this generation”.
Jesus said that some of his listeners (and the high priest at his trial) would still be alive to see his return to Earth.

So tell me you filthy apologist, what evidence do you have that contradicts your own Bible?

Because right now this is all you've got ...



Now bring some evidence for you claims or shut the fuck up because your Bible doesn't support your unsubstantiated rationalizations simply because you say it does. Rather the polar opposite.

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Because when people say "this generation" they mean their own generation or at the very most the people living at the time "this generation" is said.

I was having a conversation with a historian. He said to me: "In the Late Middle Ages (1340–1400) Europe experienced the most deadly disease outbreak in history when the Black Death, the infamous pandemic of bubonic plague, hit in 1347, killing a third of the human population. It is believed that this generation subsequently became more violent as the mass mortality rate cheapened life and thus increased warfare, crime, popular revolt, waves of flagellants, and persecution." (this is a fictional conversation used as an illustration, facts taken from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bubonic_pl...t_outbreak)

Is the historian speaking of his generation as the one that experienced the Black death?

Obviously not as a historian he was talking about the generation living during the plague. But Jesus was talking in the present tense to the people right there in front of him. Jesus was referring to this generation standing before him, not some future generation. What you are saying is disingenuous. It's like Clinton and the definition of "is". Any ordinary reading of the Bible leads to the conclusion that Jesus meant his own generation. Everything else is a weird stretch.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

When Zephaniah chapter 1 happens it'll be a good opportunity to get some sea-side lots.