Mary Sue, Marty Stu
August 13, 2014 at 12:12 am
(This post was last modified: August 13, 2014 at 12:16 am by DeistPaladin.)
For once, I'm going to start a thread that's not about religion or politics and discuss a lighter subject.
In another thread about Robin Williams, the movie "Good Will Hunting" was mentioned. IMO, Robin Williams was the only good (or tolerable) part of that movie. I mentioned that the main character, played by the emotionally flat Matt Daemon, struck me as being a tiresome "Marty Stu".
It actually got me thinking about the "Mary Sue"/"Marty Stu" trope and wanted to open a discussion as to what other examples of this story telling faux paus made its way onto the silver screen or some other published medium.
For those who aren't familiar with the trope, it's an author self-insertion as a form of wish-fulfillment. There's an important distinction between story-telling and fantasizing. The Mary Sue-Marty Stu character crosses that line, beyond just the heroic or exceptional and into the ridiculous. They know everything, are skilled at everything, are instantly admired/loved/respected/envied by nearly everyone for no apparent reason and have no character flaws aside from ones that add to their appeal.
Different people will have different standards or ideas of exactly when a hero/heroine is identified as fitting the trope, so there may be some disagreement here as to what qualifies.
"Will Hunting" seems to tick off every checkbox of the Marty Stu. He's not just a born intuitive mathematics genius but he's an expert on everything in every field of study. He's read and memorized every book in his local library. And he's a body builder, of course. And he's super cool and liked by everyone, except for those hapless unnamed characters he quickly humiliates with his superior wit and intimidating presence. His only character flaw, common with Marty Stu types, is he is brooding and edgy. Will Hunting's only struggle is realizing he deserves to realize his potential and live the great life he's destined for.
"Twilight" features what I think is a good example of a Mary Sue trope as the main character. Bella arrives at a new school and is instantly popular for no apparent reason. Two hot guys fall madly in love with her, again for no apparent reason, and the series is dominated by their fight over her affections.
Does anyone have any Mary Sues or Marty Stus you've spotted in movies or other professionally published story?
P.S. My wife is an author and introduced me to the trope and how to identify it. She's paraded many a badly written fanfic for us to laugh at and calls me in when Chris Hardwick on @Midnight when he does Fanfiction Theater (where the Mary Sue characters are identified, acted out and laughed at).
These tropes should be expected in internet fanfics. What amazes me is how they make it all the way to professional publications which ought to do a better job screening these things.
In another thread about Robin Williams, the movie "Good Will Hunting" was mentioned. IMO, Robin Williams was the only good (or tolerable) part of that movie. I mentioned that the main character, played by the emotionally flat Matt Daemon, struck me as being a tiresome "Marty Stu".
It actually got me thinking about the "Mary Sue"/"Marty Stu" trope and wanted to open a discussion as to what other examples of this story telling faux paus made its way onto the silver screen or some other published medium.
For those who aren't familiar with the trope, it's an author self-insertion as a form of wish-fulfillment. There's an important distinction between story-telling and fantasizing. The Mary Sue-Marty Stu character crosses that line, beyond just the heroic or exceptional and into the ridiculous. They know everything, are skilled at everything, are instantly admired/loved/respected/envied by nearly everyone for no apparent reason and have no character flaws aside from ones that add to their appeal.
Different people will have different standards or ideas of exactly when a hero/heroine is identified as fitting the trope, so there may be some disagreement here as to what qualifies.
"Will Hunting" seems to tick off every checkbox of the Marty Stu. He's not just a born intuitive mathematics genius but he's an expert on everything in every field of study. He's read and memorized every book in his local library. And he's a body builder, of course. And he's super cool and liked by everyone, except for those hapless unnamed characters he quickly humiliates with his superior wit and intimidating presence. His only character flaw, common with Marty Stu types, is he is brooding and edgy. Will Hunting's only struggle is realizing he deserves to realize his potential and live the great life he's destined for.
"Twilight" features what I think is a good example of a Mary Sue trope as the main character. Bella arrives at a new school and is instantly popular for no apparent reason. Two hot guys fall madly in love with her, again for no apparent reason, and the series is dominated by their fight over her affections.
Does anyone have any Mary Sues or Marty Stus you've spotted in movies or other professionally published story?
P.S. My wife is an author and introduced me to the trope and how to identify it. She's paraded many a badly written fanfic for us to laugh at and calls me in when Chris Hardwick on @Midnight when he does Fanfiction Theater (where the Mary Sue characters are identified, acted out and laughed at).
These tropes should be expected in internet fanfics. What amazes me is how they make it all the way to professional publications which ought to do a better job screening these things.
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
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