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RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
January 15, 2015 at 7:55 pm
(This post was last modified: January 15, 2015 at 7:59 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
You must never have read any of my posts on the matter. I don;t conflate human beings as posessing proprietary rights on intelligence at all.
-but that doesn't change the simple fact that you had made no observations of any other kind of intelligence, and so your conclusion must content itself to comment upon human intelligence. Observing an "intelligent signal" is actually evidence for the intelligence of the observer firstly, not the intelligence of the signal or it's origin. We've been there before - in case you weren't aware. No one has to falsify your ridiculous propositions, you understand that right? I was just being polite when I did so. Hasn't stopped you from making the claim though.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
January 15, 2015 at 7:59 pm
(January 15, 2015 at 7:55 pm)Rhythm Wrote: You must never have read any of my posts on the matter. I don;t conflate human beings as posessing proprietary rights on intelligence at all.
You say that you do not but then you go on to argue that they are conflated. You and esquilax argue that if I reject the proposition:
All evolutionary systems require humans
I must then reject the proposition:
All evolutionary systems require intellect
Of course your arguments are silly and I have shown them to be such.
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RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
January 15, 2015 at 8:00 pm
We're commenting on your argument, not our own positions. As you've been told multiple times.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
January 15, 2015 at 8:03 pm
(January 15, 2015 at 8:00 pm)Rhythm Wrote: We're commenting on your argument, not our own positions. As you've been told multiple times.
You are criticizing my argument using faulty-silly thinking......and now I am just pointing out your faulty-silly thinking.
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RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
January 15, 2015 at 8:10 pm
(This post was last modified: January 15, 2015 at 8:14 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Comp, non seq, faulty premise, assumes conclusion, lacks necessary -and- sufficient condition.
Yeah, silly silly me. 
Show your beliefs a little more respect, if you expect anyone else to. Personally, I don't think you're ignorant -or- silly, I know that you're willing to lie for christ - which is worse, in my estimation. Ignorant or silly I could deal with. Lay out your syllogism, make your case. Said it before, I'll say it again. Put or shut up time.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
January 15, 2015 at 8:18 pm
(This post was last modified: January 15, 2015 at 8:20 pm by IATIA.)
ON and on and on and on and on about this intellect thing. What does intellect or observation or observation by intellect have to do with any evolutionary system? Evolution was going on for 3 billion plus years before any intellect was around to observe, document or whatever. Intellect came from evolution, not the other way around.
And I noticed you did not address my queries.
(January 15, 2015 at 4:57 am)Heywood Wrote: Because evolutionary systems have only been observed coming into existence in the presence of intellect(s) Says who? Heywood Wrote:and since humans could not have been present when the evolutionary system which created us came into existence, we can use the evolutionary system which created us to infer the existence of a non human intellect. You have to show that intellect is required.
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RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
January 15, 2015 at 8:19 pm
He'd rather assert it, and then pretend that people haven't taken the time to show the assertion to be untenable.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
January 15, 2015 at 8:28 pm
(This post was last modified: January 15, 2015 at 8:28 pm by bennyboy.)
This is stupid.
The point of evolution is that it's a statistical process involving random events, some of which persist through time longer than others. Asserting that random events require intellect only shows that one doesn't believe in random events, and therefore in evolution. So what?
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RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
January 15, 2015 at 8:38 pm
(January 15, 2015 at 8:28 pm)bennyboy Wrote: This is stupid.
The point of evolution is that it's a statistical process involving random events, some of which persist through time longer than others. Asserting that random events require intellect only shows that one doesn't believe in random events, and therefore in evolution. So what?
The funny thing is he thinks his religion is the only to attack science or try to co-opt it. He'd be wrong because I have seen Muslims and Jews and even a couple of Hindus pull it.
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RE: Detecting design or intent in nature
January 15, 2015 at 9:11 pm
(January 15, 2015 at 8:18 pm)IATIA Wrote: Intellect came from evolution, not the other way around.
I know you believe that as a matter of faith, but certain observations of the world suggest your belief isn't correct. Every evolutionary systems we've observed coming into existence has required an intellect or intellects. Further we've never observed an evolutionary system come into existence that did not require intellect or intellects. These observations are evidence which support the proposition:
All evolutionary systems require intellects
If you have any evidence to support your proposition...that evolutionary systems can exist without intellects....then I would like to see it. Show us an observation of an evolutionary system coming into existence without an intellect.
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