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RE: JESUS <3
July 16, 2015 at 11:26 am
(This post was last modified: July 16, 2015 at 11:32 am by Minimalist.)
(July 16, 2015 at 11:12 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Thanks for everyone's responses!
Do you guys believe that Mohammad, Cleopatra, Aristotle were real people?
We have evidence for Cleopatra (VII, I assume you mean as the Ptolemaic Dynasty re-cycled names) and Aristotle. For Mo we have nothing but the later pious bleating of believers.
Among religious figures that seems to be fairly commonplace.
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RE: JESUS <3
July 16, 2015 at 12:32 pm
(This post was last modified: July 16, 2015 at 12:33 pm by Thumpalumpacus.)
I don't know if Jesus was real or not, and don't really care.
(July 15, 2015 at 8:26 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I have another question, since it seems the majority of you don't think Jesus was any type of real person, does it bother you that much of the world uses His (supposed) birth to tell time?
I'm talking about the fact that we're in the year 2015... and anything before that is referred to as Before Christ? (BC)
Nah, it never bothered me. I guess I got over that when I lived in Iran ... when I got there, they were on the Mohammedan calendar, marking that year (1974) as 1352, if I remember correctly.
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RE: JESUS <3
July 16, 2015 at 12:50 pm
Just saw the thread now - and so I'm answering the original question.
I don't know if he was a real person. There's no historical evidence for his existence as there's no evidence for his non existence. There might have been a real person, there might have been several persons being mashed into one legendary figure once the tales made their rounds on the trade routes or there might have been nothing at all.
All the Roman authors, as far as their accounts haven't been forged at a later time, only retell what christians claimed to be their origin. And that is mainly the problem when dealing with ancient authors and historians. They only gave an account of what they heard. They didn't do checks and rechecks like we do today. That's what most people don't understand.
A good example may be the account of Plini the Younger about the outbreak of Mount Vesuvius. We can check the veracity of that account archeologically as well as geologically. As opposed to accounts that only rely on oral history so to speak.
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RE: JESUS <3
July 16, 2015 at 1:01 pm
(July 15, 2015 at 6:59 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I'm simply asking if you think there was a man 2000ish years ago named Jesus who brought forth these new "ideas" that we now call Christianity.
I don't know if there was a man that Jesus and Christianity was based on, but it's plausible. But I chose "I don't think so" because of that last part. I don't think the ideas being put forth were new, and we don't know how many of those were brought forth by the man Jesus was based on, versus how much of it was created by those who came afterwards. Christianity may have been a whole lot of separate but slightly similar belief systems that gradually coalesced into something that a powerful enough authority was able to sculpt into a more-or-less final form.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."
-Stephen Jay Gould
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RE: JESUS <3
July 16, 2015 at 2:58 pm
There was no "man named Jesus" because Jesus isn't a Jewish name, it's a Romanization. At best, he might have been named Jehoshua, which was a common Jewish name of the day. So no, as the question was asked, it's not true.
There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide mankind that cannot be achieved as well or better through secular means.
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RE: JESUS <3
July 16, 2015 at 4:27 pm
I just want to point out that none of the ideas that make seem to make up Christianity seem to come from the Jesus portrayed in the gospels. They seem to come from Paul and early church leaders like tertullian
To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
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RE: JESUS <3
July 16, 2015 at 4:32 pm
Christianity is a plagiarism of Judaism, which is a plagiarism of Zoriastrianism, which....
Flood myths, dying and rising gods, you name it. It ain't even original bullshit.
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RE: JESUS <3
July 16, 2015 at 4:33 pm
Also, the uncapitalized 'I's in the poll answers are giving me a headache
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RE: JESUS <3
July 16, 2015 at 6:29 pm
(July 16, 2015 at 11:12 am)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Thanks for everyone's responses!
Do you guys believe that Mohammad, Cleopatra, Aristotle were real people?
How about Buddha? Do ya'll believe he was a real person? 
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: JESUS <3
July 16, 2015 at 6:50 pm
Let's see....
Wiki, help:
Quote:Gautama Buddha, also known as Siddhārtha Gautama,[note 3] Shakyamuni,[note 4] or simply the Buddha, was a sage[3] on whose teachings Buddhism was founded.[web 2] He is believed to have lived and taught mostly in eastern India sometime between the sixth and fourth centuries BCE.[4][note 5]
The word Buddha means "awakened one" or "the enlightened one". "Buddha" is also used as a title for the first awakened being in a Yuga era. In most Buddhist traditions, Siddhartha Gautama is regarded as the Supreme Buddha (Pali sammāsambuddha, Sanskrit samyaksaṃbuddha) of our age.
[...]
Gautama is the primary figure in Buddhism and accounts of his life, discourses, and monastic rules are believed by Buddhists to have been summarized after his death and memorized by his followers. Various collections of teachings attributed to him were passed down by oral tradition and first committed to writing about 400 years later.
400 years later?! Damn, that one was even colder than J.C.!
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