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Current time: January 25, 2025, 8:05 pm

Poll: Was Hitler objectively bad?
This poll is closed.
Yes
52.63%
20 52.63%
No
39.47%
15 39.47%
I dont know
7.89%
3 7.89%
Total 38 vote(s) 100%
* You voted for this item. [Show Results]

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Was Hitler objectively bad?
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad?
theVOID Wrote:This is rooted in the same false objection answered above. Even if you don't want to call it morality, you can be objectively wrong in thinking that desire x will be the one that brings about a state of affairs in which more and stronger desires are fulfilled. It may be that you think keeping slaves will bring about a better state of affairs, in which case you are objectively wrong. You may think voting for party y will bring about a better state of affairs where it turns out to be wrong.

Using a methodology for evaluating desires we can be more accurate in determining which desires tend to lead to a better state of affairs.

I would argue that this is very much morality, but whether you want to call it that or not desires exist and are the only reasons for action that exist, and there is an objectively true or false standard by which we can judge desires by their tenancy to bring about a state of affairs in which more and stronger desires are promoted vs thwarted.

It's true that we can objectively assess what will promote the fulfilment of most desires, and that desires are the only reason for action that exist. You still have to bridge the is-ought gap by explaining why we should desire things that fufill others' desires, rather than just our own. 'Ought' only makes sense within the context of a hypothetical sentence like 'If you want to succeed, you ought to study hard'. Of course, you could say, as you have, that desirism succeeds if we wish to promote others' desires, but there is no objective reason for us to want to do so. Thus, I can't see how desirism solves any problems that are not solved by, say, preference utilitarianism, which is similar to desirism in its normative prescriptions, but doesn't claim to solve any meta-ethical difficulties.
'We must respect the other fellow's religion, but only in the sense and to the extent that we respect his theory that his wife is beautiful and his children smart.' H.L. Mencken

'False religion' is the ultimate tautology.

'It is just like man's vanity and impertinence to call an animal dumb because it is dumb to his dull perceptions.' Mark Twain

'I care not much for a man's religion whose dog and cat are not the better for it.' Abraham Lincoln
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Messages In This Thread
Was Hitler objectively bad? - by solja247 - September 17, 2010 at 6:52 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Watson - September 17, 2010 at 7:05 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Tiberius - September 17, 2010 at 7:11 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by padraic - September 17, 2010 at 7:16 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Entropist - September 17, 2010 at 7:19 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - September 17, 2010 at 7:23 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by solja247 - September 17, 2010 at 7:25 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Entropist - September 17, 2010 at 7:28 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Anomalocaris - September 29, 2010 at 5:44 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 17, 2010 at 12:58 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - October 17, 2010 at 5:14 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 17, 2010 at 7:15 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - October 20, 2010 at 6:56 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - October 20, 2010 at 6:05 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - October 20, 2010 at 6:35 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - October 20, 2010 at 7:16 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - October 21, 2010 at 11:54 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - October 21, 2010 at 6:29 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - October 22, 2010 at 7:29 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - October 26, 2010 at 9:17 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - October 29, 2010 at 10:57 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - November 1, 2010 at 7:32 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - November 4, 2010 at 7:00 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - November 4, 2010 at 5:21 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by solja247 - September 17, 2010 at 7:28 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Entropist - September 17, 2010 at 7:52 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by HeyItsZeus - September 17, 2010 at 8:16 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - September 17, 2010 at 8:40 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by padraic - September 18, 2010 at 12:42 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by solja247 - September 18, 2010 at 1:12 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Entropist - September 18, 2010 at 1:18 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - September 18, 2010 at 1:26 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Welsh cake - September 18, 2010 at 1:25 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by solja247 - September 18, 2010 at 1:34 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - September 18, 2010 at 1:38 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Entropist - September 18, 2010 at 1:44 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by padraic - September 18, 2010 at 2:03 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by solja247 - September 18, 2010 at 8:02 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Entropist - September 18, 2010 at 8:08 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - September 18, 2010 at 8:12 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Skipper - September 18, 2010 at 8:46 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by solja247 - September 18, 2010 at 9:07 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Skipper - September 18, 2010 at 9:16 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by tackattack - September 18, 2010 at 9:27 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by solja247 - September 18, 2010 at 9:29 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Skipper - September 18, 2010 at 9:39 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Entropist - September 18, 2010 at 9:37 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by tackattack - September 18, 2010 at 9:38 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - September 18, 2010 at 9:38 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - September 18, 2010 at 9:41 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Entropist - September 18, 2010 at 9:48 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - September 18, 2010 at 9:55 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by krazedkat - September 19, 2010 at 1:37 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by lrh9 - September 19, 2010 at 5:32 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by downbeatplumb - September 19, 2010 at 12:52 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Cego_Colher - September 19, 2010 at 3:59 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by KichigaiNeko - September 20, 2010 at 4:48 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Dotard - September 20, 2010 at 10:53 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by lucidproject44 - September 27, 2010 at 4:51 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - September 27, 2010 at 10:53 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by The Omnissiunt One - September 27, 2010 at 5:28 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - September 28, 2010 at 5:06 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - September 28, 2010 at 5:20 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - September 28, 2010 at 5:23 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - September 28, 2010 at 5:25 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - September 28, 2010 at 8:17 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - September 28, 2010 at 8:30 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by padraic - September 29, 2010 at 6:31 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Anomalocaris - September 29, 2010 at 6:35 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by tackattack - September 29, 2010 at 11:34 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by padraic - September 30, 2010 at 2:31 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - September 30, 2010 at 2:02 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by leo-rcc - September 30, 2010 at 4:00 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - September 30, 2010 at 4:20 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by padraic - September 30, 2010 at 6:08 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - September 30, 2010 at 7:20 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - September 30, 2010 at 12:16 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Violet - October 2, 2010 at 1:03 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 16, 2010 at 8:24 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by padraic - October 16, 2010 at 6:58 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 16, 2010 at 7:09 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by little_monkey - October 16, 2010 at 10:59 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Rev. Rye - October 16, 2010 at 10:38 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 16, 2010 at 10:47 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 16, 2010 at 11:03 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Rev. Rye - October 17, 2010 at 4:17 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - October 16, 2010 at 10:50 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 16, 2010 at 11:00 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 16, 2010 at 11:05 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 16, 2010 at 11:07 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by The Omnissiunt One - October 17, 2010 at 4:58 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 16, 2010 at 11:13 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 16, 2010 at 11:18 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 16, 2010 at 11:19 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - October 16, 2010 at 11:48 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 16, 2010 at 11:51 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - October 17, 2010 at 12:00 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 17, 2010 at 12:05 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by padraic - October 17, 2010 at 2:37 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 17, 2010 at 2:47 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Anomalocaris - October 17, 2010 at 3:22 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 17, 2010 at 12:02 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 17, 2010 at 12:14 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - October 17, 2010 at 1:09 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 17, 2010 at 1:43 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - October 17, 2010 at 9:01 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Shell B - October 17, 2010 at 1:49 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 17, 2010 at 2:28 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Shell B - October 17, 2010 at 1:16 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - October 17, 2010 at 1:42 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - October 17, 2010 at 7:24 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 17, 2010 at 7:51 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Shell B - October 17, 2010 at 7:52 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 17, 2010 at 7:59 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Shell B - October 17, 2010 at 8:02 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 17, 2010 at 8:13 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Shell B - October 17, 2010 at 8:17 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Rev. Rye - October 17, 2010 at 9:08 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ChromodynamicGirl - October 17, 2010 at 9:11 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Shell B - October 17, 2010 at 9:19 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - October 17, 2010 at 8:05 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Anomalocaris - October 17, 2010 at 9:28 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - October 17, 2010 at 8:00 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 17, 2010 at 9:17 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Rev. Rye - October 17, 2010 at 10:19 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - October 18, 2010 at 6:52 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Rev. Rye - October 18, 2010 at 2:31 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 17, 2010 at 10:40 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Rev. Rye - October 17, 2010 at 10:45 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 17, 2010 at 11:13 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Anomalocaris - October 18, 2010 at 3:15 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - October 18, 2010 at 3:26 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by gmjackson - October 18, 2010 at 4:43 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 18, 2010 at 11:14 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by little_monkey - October 19, 2010 at 7:51 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 19, 2010 at 8:42 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - October 19, 2010 at 8:53 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 19, 2010 at 9:05 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - October 19, 2010 at 9:18 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 19, 2010 at 9:33 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - October 19, 2010 at 9:47 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by leo-rcc - October 19, 2010 at 10:06 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by ib.me.ub - October 19, 2010 at 11:18 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Eilonnwy - October 21, 2010 at 2:25 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by KichigaiNeko - October 22, 2010 at 6:57 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Edwardo Piet - October 21, 2010 at 2:34 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - October 22, 2010 at 8:07 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Justtristo - October 25, 2010 at 2:02 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Anomalocaris - October 25, 2010 at 2:17 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Minimalist - October 25, 2010 at 1:28 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by The Omnissiunt One - October 25, 2010 at 10:30 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - October 26, 2010 at 11:22 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by The Omnissiunt One - October 27, 2010 at 7:13 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by theVOID - November 1, 2010 at 6:00 pm
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by The Skeptic - October 31, 2010 at 11:44 am
RE: Was Hitler objectively bad? - by Zen Badger - November 4, 2010 at 7:06 am

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