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The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem
#66
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem
(August 5, 2015 at 2:58 pm)Minimalist Wrote: But there are facts.

3- The most prolific mid second century xtian writer, Justin, never mentions any of those so-called gospels not does he seem to know anything about any "paul."  He does know about Marcion, however.

Facts, Min? Really? You're sure? [Image: rolleyes.gif]

"Justin serves, moreover, as a crucial witness to the status of the 2nd-century New Testament corpus, mentioning the first three Gospels and quoting and paraphrasing the letters of Paul and 1 Peter; he was the first known writer to quote from the Acts of the Apostles." [Source.]

"He knew and quoted especially the Gospels of Matthew and Luke; he must have known the Gospel of Mark as well, though there is only one explicit reference to this Gospel (Dial. 106.3); he apparently had no knowledge of the Gospel of John." In footnote #2, Kester notes: "The only possible reference to the Gospel of John is the quotation of a saying in 1 Apol. 61.4.." (Helmut Koester (1990) Ancient Christian Gospels, pp. 360–361; p. 360)

[Image: 51A7-iOFSkL._SX319_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg]

We can learn more about Justin Martyr's use of scripture from this Wikipedia article which states in part:

Gospels

Justin uses material from the Synoptic Gospels (Matthew, Mark, and Luke) in the composition of the First Apology and the Dialogue, either directly, as in the case of Matthew,[40] or indirectly through the use of a gospel harmony, which may have been composed by Justin or his school.[41] However, his use, or even knowledge, of the Gospel of John is uncertain. One possible reference to John is a saying that is quoted in the context of a description of Christian baptism (1 Apol. 61.4 – "Unless you are reborn, you cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven."). However, Koester contends that Justin obtained this saying from a baptismal liturgy rather than a written gospel.[42] Justins knowledge of John's gospel however is further substantiated in that he adds a clear allusion to John 3:4 directly after quoting verse 3 about the new birth ("Now, that it is impossible for those who have once been born to enter their mother's womb is manifest to all"). There are also other quotes from John, such as John 1:20 and John 1:28. Furthermore, by employing the term "memoirs of the apostles" and distinguishing them from the writings of their "followers", Justin must have been aware of at least two gospels written by actual apostles. Since one of these must be Matthew, the other can be inferred as John's.[citation needed]

Apocalypse

Justin does not quote from the Book of Revelation directly, yet he clearly refers to it, naming John as its author (Dial. 81.4 "Moreover also among us a man named John, one of the apostles of Christ, prophesied in a revelation made to him that those who have believed on our Christ will spend a thousand years in Jerusalem; and that hereafter the general and, in short, the eternal resurrection and judgment of all will likewise take place"). Scholar Brooke Westcott notes that this reference to the author of the single prophetic book of the New Testament illustrates the distinction Justin made between the role of prophecy and fulfillment quotations from the gospels, as Justin does not mention any of the individual canonical gospels by name.[43]

Letters

Reflecting his opposition to Marcion, Justin's attitude toward the Pauline epistles generally corresponds to that of the later Church. In Justin's works, distinct references are found to Romans, 1 Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Colossians, and 2 Thessalonians, and possible ones to Philippians, Titus, and 1 Timothy. It seems likely that he also knew Hebrews and 1 John. The apologetic character of Justin's habit of thought appears again in the Acts of his martyrdom, the genuineness of which is attested by internal evidence.[44]

Quote:I'll let you chew on those for a while.  I have some stuff to do.

We're done chewing on that...and spitting it out. [Image: wink.gif]
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Messages In This Thread
The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 4, 2015 at 1:29 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Longhorn - August 4, 2015 at 1:32 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by robvalue - August 4, 2015 at 1:36 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 4, 2015 at 3:52 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by robvalue - August 5, 2015 at 6:48 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Pizza - August 5, 2015 at 10:59 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by robvalue - August 5, 2015 at 12:37 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Brakeman - August 5, 2015 at 12:56 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Kingpin - August 5, 2015 at 1:15 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Kingpin - August 5, 2015 at 1:59 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Neo-Scholastic - August 5, 2015 at 6:44 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Pyrrho - August 5, 2015 at 7:01 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Cato - August 5, 2015 at 7:22 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 5, 2015 at 7:48 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 7, 2015 at 12:20 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 8, 2015 at 12:28 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 8, 2015 at 11:50 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 5, 2015 at 1:59 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 5, 2015 at 2:02 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Kingpin - August 5, 2015 at 2:11 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Kingpin - August 5, 2015 at 2:36 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 5, 2015 at 2:16 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Kingpin - August 5, 2015 at 2:26 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by KevinM1 - August 5, 2015 at 2:41 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Kingpin - August 5, 2015 at 2:44 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 5, 2015 at 2:58 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 23, 2015 at 12:17 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 23, 2015 at 12:36 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 23, 2015 at 8:43 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 23, 2015 at 8:49 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 24, 2015 at 3:13 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by robvalue - August 5, 2015 at 3:26 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by robvalue - August 6, 2015 at 4:54 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Pizza - August 6, 2015 at 10:58 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Cato - August 6, 2015 at 10:53 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by robvalue - August 6, 2015 at 11:01 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Pizza - August 6, 2015 at 12:13 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 6, 2015 at 1:59 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Esquilax - August 6, 2015 at 12:18 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Pizza - August 6, 2015 at 12:23 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Esquilax - August 6, 2015 at 12:28 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 6, 2015 at 12:29 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 6, 2015 at 11:41 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Brakeman - August 6, 2015 at 12:36 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 6, 2015 at 12:42 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Pizza - August 8, 2015 at 12:11 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 9, 2015 at 1:29 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Brian37 - August 9, 2015 at 1:40 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 9, 2015 at 1:51 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 12, 2015 at 11:57 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 12, 2015 at 5:15 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 12, 2015 at 6:07 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 14, 2015 at 10:46 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 21, 2015 at 6:09 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by robvalue - August 22, 2015 at 8:58 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 22, 2015 at 10:05 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 22, 2015 at 11:50 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 22, 2015 at 12:06 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 22, 2015 at 12:09 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 22, 2015 at 12:24 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 22, 2015 at 1:29 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 22, 2015 at 4:51 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 22, 2015 at 5:04 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Brakeman - August 23, 2015 at 9:17 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Aractus - August 23, 2015 at 11:16 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 23, 2015 at 11:50 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 23, 2015 at 8:20 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Aractus - August 23, 2015 at 8:57 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 23, 2015 at 9:01 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Silver - August 24, 2015 at 2:35 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Aractus - August 24, 2015 at 3:15 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 24, 2015 at 3:19 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Brakeman - August 24, 2015 at 9:52 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 24, 2015 at 10:07 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 23, 2015 at 11:36 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Aractus - August 23, 2015 at 7:19 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 23, 2015 at 8:25 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Aractus - August 24, 2015 at 2:31 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by robvalue - August 24, 2015 at 3:07 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Aractus - August 24, 2015 at 3:32 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 24, 2015 at 6:18 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 24, 2015 at 7:19 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Wyrd of Gawd - August 25, 2015 at 12:11 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Aractus - August 24, 2015 at 10:33 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Aractus - August 24, 2015 at 6:35 am
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Minimalist - August 24, 2015 at 10:23 pm
RE: The Three-Headed "Jesus" Problem - by Randy Carson - August 24, 2015 at 11:25 pm

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