Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: December 13, 2024, 4:59 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies!
#65
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies!
(November 15, 2010 at 6:46 pm)cdog Wrote: Ah sorry I misread, I thought you had said the gospels agreed jesus died on the day of preparation for the passover.

The thing is, in mark jesus eats the passover meal with his disciples. However John claims Jesus was sentenced on the day of preparation

John 19:14 "It was the day of Preparation of the Passover; it was about noon.

“Here is your king,” Pilate said to the Jews. "

So unless you think it took them 18 hours to get around to crucifying him (that is 9am passover day), which certainly isn't indicated by john, the stories still don't match up. I think the important part here is that john's version not only leaves out the passover meal scene, but makes it impossible to happen. John's version does have a last supper, but it is much different than mark's passover meal scene; but I think you already know this.


Sorry for being so late getting back to you on this cdog. Here's Ehrman's answer for the discrepancy between "john" and the others.

Quote:I can’t give a full analysis here, but I will point out a signifi cant
feature of John’s Gospel—the last of our Gospels to be written,
probably some twenty-five years or so after Mark’s. John is the only
Gospel that indicates that Jesus is “the lamb of God who takes away
the sins of the world.” This is declared by John the Baptist at the
very beginning of the narrative (John 1:29) and again six verses
later (John 1:35). Why, then, did John—our latest Gospel—change
the day and time when Jesus died? It may be because in John’s
Gospel, Jesus is the Passover Lamb, whose sacrifice brings salvation
from sins. Exactly like the Passover Lamb, Jesus has to die on the
day (the Day of Preparation) and the time (sometime after noon),
when the Passover lambs were being slaughtered in the Temple.

In other words, John has changed a historical datum in order to
make a theological point: Jesus is the sacrificial lamb. And to convey
this theological point, John has had to create a discrepancy between
his account and the others.


In other words, changing the day is a plot device. Plot devices are very common in fictional writing.


Quote:My point was that while that certainly is an interesting theory, I haven't seen it in a scholarly work, and it seems to be that you are claiming that idea as your own, which would explain it. Please do correct me if I'm wrong.


I wouldn't presume to assume that it is mine, alone. I have not read everything ever written on the subject. I also don't know that I'd dignify it with the word "theory" which has a definitive scientific meaning and one which continually eludes creationists.

I'm merely noting the convergence of coincidences and, as I said above, coincidences make me ill.

BTW, if more theists could discuss/debate as you do I'd be a lot less cranky.


Reply



Messages In This Thread
Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - October 27, 2010 at 2:46 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Jaysyn - October 27, 2010 at 3:24 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by theVOID - October 27, 2010 at 6:51 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Justtristo - November 14, 2010 at 7:02 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - October 27, 2010 at 8:12 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Jonah - October 27, 2010 at 10:48 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - October 27, 2010 at 11:08 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - October 28, 2010 at 12:08 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by theVOID - October 28, 2010 at 3:09 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - October 28, 2010 at 12:41 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by theVOID - October 28, 2010 at 4:27 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by lilyannerose - December 2, 2010 at 12:46 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Anomalocaris - October 28, 2010 at 12:23 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - October 28, 2010 at 10:57 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Jaysyn - October 28, 2010 at 11:17 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Anomalocaris - October 28, 2010 at 12:20 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - October 28, 2010 at 12:49 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - October 28, 2010 at 11:24 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - October 28, 2010 at 11:53 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - October 28, 2010 at 1:42 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - October 28, 2010 at 5:27 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by theophilus - October 28, 2010 at 2:48 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - October 28, 2010 at 3:47 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by theVOID - October 28, 2010 at 4:31 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - October 28, 2010 at 4:32 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - October 28, 2010 at 5:32 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - October 28, 2010 at 7:49 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by The Skeptic - October 31, 2010 at 8:24 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - October 31, 2010 at 9:38 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - November 1, 2010 at 12:59 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by downbeatplumb - November 14, 2010 at 6:15 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 1, 2010 at 1:14 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - November 4, 2010 at 9:59 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 4, 2010 at 5:48 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - November 5, 2010 at 11:52 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Anomalocaris - November 4, 2010 at 7:08 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 4, 2010 at 7:30 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Anomalocaris - November 4, 2010 at 7:34 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by solja247 - November 4, 2010 at 8:00 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 4, 2010 at 9:28 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - November 4, 2010 at 9:39 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 4, 2010 at 9:40 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 4, 2010 at 10:25 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by coffeeveritas - November 5, 2010 at 4:45 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 5, 2010 at 11:32 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 5, 2010 at 10:37 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 6, 2010 at 3:03 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - November 6, 2010 at 7:43 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by coffeeveritas - November 8, 2010 at 6:18 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by theVOID - November 8, 2010 at 6:29 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by coffeeveritas - November 13, 2010 at 4:53 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 6, 2010 at 2:28 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - November 15, 2010 at 12:00 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by cdog - November 15, 2010 at 4:04 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Godschild - November 15, 2010 at 5:46 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by theVOID - November 6, 2010 at 7:53 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 6, 2010 at 8:32 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 8, 2010 at 7:58 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 13, 2010 at 6:57 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by coffeeveritas - November 14, 2010 at 1:49 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Anomalocaris - November 13, 2010 at 8:01 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by cdog - November 15, 2010 at 6:46 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 20, 2010 at 2:43 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 17, 2010 at 1:26 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 17, 2010 at 8:39 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by coffeeveritas - November 17, 2010 at 9:36 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 28, 2010 at 5:08 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by theophilus - November 30, 2010 at 1:45 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - November 30, 2010 at 2:57 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Justtristo - December 1, 2010 at 2:27 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - December 1, 2010 at 3:22 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by theophilus - December 1, 2010 at 11:32 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - December 1, 2010 at 12:29 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Justtristo - December 2, 2010 at 6:08 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - December 2, 2010 at 1:48 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Chapabel - December 2, 2010 at 1:39 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - December 2, 2010 at 7:34 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Chapabel - December 3, 2010 at 5:56 am
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - December 3, 2010 at 12:02 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Chapabel - December 3, 2010 at 12:09 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - December 6, 2010 at 4:14 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Anomalocaris - December 7, 2010 at 1:29 pm
RE: Bart D. Ehrman - The Bane of Fundies! - by Minimalist - December 7, 2010 at 1:36 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Bart Ehrman is an hero LinuxGal 44 4336 November 4, 2023 at 9:48 pm
Last Post: Anomalocaris
  What do the conservative Christians here think of Professor Bart Ehrman? Jehanne 69 7678 March 8, 2019 at 10:44 am
Last Post: Jehanne
  The Big Debate -- Price versus Ehrman Jehanne 43 11089 November 26, 2016 at 3:42 pm
Last Post: Jehanne
  Bart Ehrman destroys Christianity in under 12 minutes. Jehanne 145 20510 July 1, 2016 at 8:42 pm
Last Post: Minimalist
  Bart Ehrman Has A New Book Coming Out Minimalist 20 4308 March 23, 2016 at 11:52 am
Last Post: Minimalist
  The Fundies are Whining Again drfuzzy 20 4582 February 27, 2016 at 7:40 am
Last Post: robvalue
  The question that makes fundies hostile Godlesspanther 331 113273 December 20, 2013 at 4:24 pm
Last Post: Jacob(smooth)
  Poor Fundies.....Hell is A Literary Construct, Too! Minimalist 128 64474 May 24, 2013 at 5:43 am
Last Post: Cyberman
  Bart Ehrman - Fuck Xmas Minimalist 23 9907 December 13, 2012 at 1:16 pm
Last Post: Samson1
  The truth according to Bart D. Ehrman Aractus 54 27336 December 2, 2012 at 6:14 am
Last Post: Aractus



Users browsing this thread: 15 Guest(s)