2015 NFL thread

[SteelCurtain]

The fact is, they were notorious for cheating in other, more effective ways.


Don van Natter Report

I don't really care about unfounded accusations and hearsay, because unless there was an actual investigation that found the Patriots doing any of those things, it's meaningless to bring them up. I don't want any cheating in the NFL, and all instances should be investigated, but until they do, you can't treat rumors as anything more than that.

Unfounded? Hearsay? Because van Natter didn't reveal his sources by name? Former Patriots coaches and staff don't count as credible sources and are rumors?

So any exposé where the writer protects his sources counts as hearsay? I disagree. This was a report sourced by over 90 NFL team executives, staff, and coaches---some of those directly related to the Patriots. The idea that it was a known thing by multiple NFL teams is significant.

To call it meaningless is just ridiculous when the people who did it or ordered it done admitted to it.

They knew what they were doing. They knew it was against the rules. They did it for years, and when they got caught, they called it a "smear job" and all the loyal New England fans went right along with it.

I don't know about that. Most fans I speak to seem to accept Spygate as a stain on our history, but I think most would also say it was overblown. As I said before, the ability to film defensive signals isn't cheating itself, and why would it be, given that the coaches are in full view of each other on opposite sides of the field anyway. Was it wrong? Yes. Was it against the rules? Yes. Was it as big a deal as it was made out to be? No.

You are missing the point. Filming in this way gives an advantage because you don't have to sacrifice Tom Brady's cameras for real time defense and shell diagnosis during the game. You see QB's and defenses on the little blue tablets during the game? That comes from several angles that are stitched together for a 3D view in real time. In order to film from the press box, you would have to sacrifice some of those cameras for signal capture. That's why teams don't do it. Because real time diagnosis of actual plays is way more productive and effective than signal capture.

That is a big deal. When you play a good team the first part of the season, you are likely going to see them again in the playoffs. If you have recorded their defensive signals, then you can garner a significant advantage if the other team plays by the rules.

Deflategate was not ever about the balls. It was about Goodell fulfilling a promise that if Belichick got caught again the punishment would be much more severe.

That makes no sense though. The NFL investigation, flawed as it was when it came to the measurements / interviews / science aspects, still concluded that the coaching staff had nothing to do with it. Belichick didn't get caught again, the NFL exonerated him specifically in the report, and instead blamed Brady and a couple of prep staff.

You are correct though; Deflategate was not ever about the balls. It was likely an attempt by Goodell to try and restore his image as someone who can give out tough punishments, as he had been criticized for not going far enough with players who beat their wives / children. At the same time, he probably wanted to demonstrate that no player was out of reach, and he took the chance to not only suspend Tom Brady, a leading quarterback and Super Bowl champion, but suspend him for 4 games for what would have been a minor equipment violation. Of course, in this case ironically he ended up being criticized for going way too far, and a federal judge told him as much.

You'll never catch me defending Goodell's grudge here. I believe that Tom knew that the balls were being tampered with, and I believe his cell phone shenanigans were an attempt to subvert the investigation. For that, I will call his integrity into question but I will admit my bias, and not try to convince anyone else.

Goodell overplayed his hand, and was beholden to the other 31 owners who are sick of Kraft/Belichick and their continuous flouting of the rules.

I have been watching the NFL my whole life. I was a Belichick fan because of his ties to my alma mater. He is a great coach. Tom Brady is a great quarterback. They don't have to cheat. Yet they do. That is an integrity issue to me, and that will make me despise them not in a small part because it affected my team directly.