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God sees - strongest argument for God.....
#58
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God.....
(October 15, 2016 at 12:49 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: tl;dr, Aquinas' fourth way Argument from Gradiation of Being

Your argument basically boils down to the assertion that because we have certain qualities there must be a being with the perfect version of said qualities. And that being must be god because, well we don't know why except for the fact that you (and before you Aquinas) are starting with the assumption that god exists therefore the argument must lead back to him (there's your circular reasoning).

There are two problems with the fourth way, 1) you're using subjective values to describe the qualities you talk about (hell, you're calling the obviously subjective conception of identity* objective so starting from a false premise as LFC pointed out), the idea of gradiations of perfection is a human idea and humans are subjectivity machines. What is "good", "better" and "best" for you could be radically different than what those are for me, e.g you could consider in relation to the Civilization series of games that the order of goodness goes 6>5>3>2>4>1, with six being the perfect iteration, whereas for me it is 4>3>2>6>5>1, with four being the best and one at the back because it is unplayable now given the improvements in 3 and especially 4.
2) Your premise six is a false assumption. Even if you could objectively prove that there is a "ultimate possible perception" you cannot say whether that perception is the creator or genesis of all other perceptions. In fact in most cases the opposite is true, e.g. the eye has developed and improved over the course of evolution from simple patches of skin sensitive to sunlight, through pinhole like eye, through the human eye, to eyes like those of certain species of shrimp or of eagles or of squid (all much better than human eyes), and with probably more improvements not yet emergent. Best does not create less good in most cases, less good creates better.


*Identity is a function of the self-referential nature of the brain. Your identity is essentially what you see yourself as, and as you will always see yourself in the light you want to see yourself as, it is going to be heavily subjective in nature.
Urbs Antiqua Fuit Studiisque Asperrima Belli

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Messages In This Thread
God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by MysticKnight - October 15, 2016 at 12:49 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Chad32 - October 15, 2016 at 12:58 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Astreja - October 15, 2016 at 9:55 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by chimp3 - October 15, 2016 at 1:13 pm
God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by LadyForCamus - October 15, 2016 at 1:17 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Angrboda - October 15, 2016 at 1:35 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Angrboda - October 15, 2016 at 2:46 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Chad32 - October 15, 2016 at 4:24 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Chad32 - October 15, 2016 at 5:14 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Chad32 - October 15, 2016 at 5:49 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Jenny A - October 22, 2016 at 2:32 am
God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by LadyForCamus - October 15, 2016 at 1:53 pm
God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by LadyForCamus - October 15, 2016 at 2:33 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Chas - October 15, 2016 at 3:58 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by brewer - October 15, 2016 at 8:22 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Arkilogue - October 15, 2016 at 10:02 pm
God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by LadyForCamus - October 15, 2016 at 9:58 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Arkilogue - October 15, 2016 at 10:25 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Silver - October 17, 2016 at 3:24 am
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by bennyboy - October 17, 2016 at 3:22 am
God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by LadyForCamus - October 15, 2016 at 10:27 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by LastPoet - October 18, 2016 at 12:10 pm
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Pat Mustard - November 3, 2016 at 6:27 am
RE: God sees - strongest argument for God..... - by Grandizer - November 3, 2016 at 11:54 am

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