Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: December 13, 2024, 9:48 pm

Thread Rating:
  • 1 Vote(s) - 1 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
God exists subjectively?
#37
RE: God exists subjectively?
(November 11, 2016 at 9:10 pm)Tonus Wrote: Aren't each of the five arguments by Aquinas an example of special pleading?  "Everything that is A must be subject to B, except for that A which we decided is not and therefore breaks the endless loop which would otherwise result."  I'm guessing he never successfully applied that thinking in his day job as a janitor.

If the Five Ways of St. Thomas Aquinas are special pleading, then everything shall be special pleading. As, he has shown us sound arguments from starting with the thing we surely know to exist: the things we can sense with our five senses and then he proceeded with logical demonstration. Hence, to deny the conclusion of 5 Ways that God must exist is to deny either reality or logic or both.

Further, it is not true that it has been decided in the 5 Way that God is special. It was demonstrated that by implying His non-existence, nothing will exist. But, that nothing will exist is absurd, for the starting point is that we know things exist. Hence, it is not just a special pleading, but it was realistically and logically demonstrated.

(November 11, 2016 at 7:13 pm)wallym Wrote:
(November 11, 2016 at 6:41 pm)Maelstrom Wrote: God exists as a concept.  

For a concept to be considered reality, there must exist the proper evidence to support it.

There has never been evidence to support the existence of god, despite there having occurred throughout history many proofs for the existence of many concepts.

Clearly, you don't need proper evidence to consider God a reality as so many do.  What we experience (or your word, conceptualize) as reality is not bound by rules of logic/physics/etc...

Your brain just has to trick you into believing God is real, and in the reality you experience, there is some God.  

Again, you keep saying concept vs. reality, but humans experience their conceptualization of the world.  Not the reality of the world.

I think we are experiencing the world and concept is built first due to that experience.

(November 11, 2016 at 7:15 pm)Rhythm Wrote:
(November 11, 2016 at 6:50 pm)theologian Wrote: 3. It is not true that there are no evidence to support the existence of God. The 5 ways of St. Thomas Aquinas is an evidence that God exist and to deny that is to deny both reality and logic, for his 5 ways are arguments which starts from the things we can sense with our 5 senses and it proceed with valid logic and true premises like principle of sufficient reason.

Well look at that, yet another word you only understand when it suits you...add it to the growing list.  No, aquinas five ways aren't -evidence-...they're -arguments-... :looks up:

I find them less than compelling.

Well, what is evidence? Isn't whatever shows you the truth is an evidence? But, arguments shows us the truth granted that it is sound. Therefore, arguments are evidence.

(November 11, 2016 at 9:27 pm)Minimalist Wrote:
Quote:I argue that what is subjective is the belief that there is no God

It is not a ""belief," dummy.  It is the net result of legions of bible-thumping assholes singularly failing to produce any evidence for their fucking fairy tales.

Don't blame us for your incompetence.

Well, we must first settle whether there is God or there isn't, before we talk about the Bible, because the truth of the Bible relies on the authority of God. So, you want to talk about that seems to you a fairy tale? If that is the case, do you grant that God exist?
Reply



Messages In This Thread
God exists subjectively? - by henryp - November 6, 2016 at 1:57 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Edwardo Piet - November 6, 2016 at 2:10 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Whateverist - November 6, 2016 at 2:11 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Silver - November 6, 2016 at 2:15 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by abaris - November 6, 2016 at 2:28 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Rhondazvous - November 7, 2016 at 1:58 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by abaris - November 7, 2016 at 2:21 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 6, 2016 at 2:34 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Edwardo Piet - November 6, 2016 at 2:48 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by henryp - November 7, 2016 at 12:21 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 7, 2016 at 12:53 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Edwardo Piet - November 11, 2016 at 8:58 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Whateverist - November 11, 2016 at 6:49 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 6, 2016 at 3:10 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 7, 2016 at 1:12 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 11, 2016 at 6:37 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 11, 2016 at 6:39 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 11, 2016 at 6:40 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Silver - November 11, 2016 at 6:41 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 11, 2016 at 6:50 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by henryp - November 11, 2016 at 7:13 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Silver - November 11, 2016 at 7:14 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by henryp - November 11, 2016 at 7:16 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Silver - November 11, 2016 at 6:51 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 11, 2016 at 7:05 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Silver - November 11, 2016 at 7:07 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Edwardo Piet - November 13, 2016 at 4:39 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Whateverist - November 11, 2016 at 7:08 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 11, 2016 at 7:11 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Whateverist - November 11, 2016 at 7:12 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Silver - November 11, 2016 at 7:14 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 11, 2016 at 9:24 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 11, 2016 at 7:15 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Edwardo Piet - November 11, 2016 at 8:58 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by henryp - November 12, 2016 at 3:57 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by henryp - November 12, 2016 at 4:06 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 12, 2016 at 4:48 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by henryp - November 12, 2016 at 5:03 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 12, 2016 at 5:45 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 11, 2016 at 9:10 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 11, 2016 at 10:46 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 12, 2016 at 2:05 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Edwardo Piet - November 11, 2016 at 9:16 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 11, 2016 at 9:27 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by LostLocke - November 12, 2016 at 12:17 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 12, 2016 at 12:48 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 12, 2016 at 11:20 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 12, 2016 at 12:16 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Angrboda - November 12, 2016 at 6:46 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 12, 2016 at 11:28 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 12, 2016 at 2:05 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by bennyboy - November 12, 2016 at 4:24 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by henryp - November 12, 2016 at 5:10 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 12, 2016 at 5:05 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 12, 2016 at 6:44 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 13, 2016 at 2:43 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 13, 2016 at 9:51 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by henryp - November 14, 2016 at 9:56 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 13, 2016 at 4:43 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Whateverist - November 13, 2016 at 9:57 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 13, 2016 at 5:55 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by bennyboy - November 13, 2016 at 8:14 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 13, 2016 at 7:03 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 13, 2016 at 8:32 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Arkilogue - November 13, 2016 at 8:40 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 13, 2016 at 9:18 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 15, 2016 at 2:48 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 16, 2016 at 4:08 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 16, 2016 at 8:48 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 16, 2016 at 11:13 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 16, 2016 at 11:53 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 17, 2016 at 12:58 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 17, 2016 at 8:46 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 20, 2016 at 6:44 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 20, 2016 at 8:07 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 20, 2016 at 10:25 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 20, 2016 at 11:20 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by bennyboy - November 16, 2016 at 10:02 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 16, 2016 at 11:42 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 17, 2016 at 1:08 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Edwardo Piet - November 16, 2016 at 2:55 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 17, 2016 at 1:04 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 17, 2016 at 1:29 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 17, 2016 at 2:05 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by The Grand Nudger - November 17, 2016 at 2:32 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 20, 2016 at 10:29 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 20, 2016 at 10:38 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Minimalist - November 20, 2016 at 10:49 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 20, 2016 at 11:05 pm
RE: God exists subjectively? - by theologian - November 21, 2016 at 2:28 am
RE: God exists subjectively? - by Tonus - November 21, 2016 at 9:04 am

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  God exists because we can imagine it Heat 46 9045 December 6, 2015 at 11:05 am
Last Post: Thumpalumpacus
  What do we do while deciding if free will exists? henryp 57 12159 April 20, 2015 at 9:56 am
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  If God exists but doesn't do anything, how would we know? And would it matter? TaraJo 7 4308 January 26, 2013 at 11:14 am
Last Post: DeistPaladin
  Do your beliefs imply a Necessary being exists? CliveStaples 124 50880 August 29, 2012 at 5:22 am
Last Post: Categories+Sheaves
  If you were certain a designer exists... Mystic 10 4637 July 21, 2012 at 1:37 pm
Last Post: Whateverist
  A One In An infinity Chance That God Exists. What Do You Guys Think? amateurlyinsightful 82 32913 July 6, 2012 at 4:37 pm
Last Post: amateurlyinsightful
  I believe everything exists. Edwardo Piet 23 6132 November 2, 2010 at 4:46 am
Last Post: Ervin
  Everything exists TruthWorthy 33 18311 March 10, 2010 at 5:40 am
Last Post: Violet



Users browsing this thread: 11 Guest(s)