RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God
July 20, 2017 at 2:54 pm
(This post was last modified: July 20, 2017 at 2:55 pm by Jehanne.)
(July 20, 2017 at 2:47 pm)RoadRunner79 Wrote:(July 20, 2017 at 12:55 pm)Jehanne Wrote: This question is the domain of particle physics. Virtual particles exist; the Casmir effect was a prediction of them:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casimir_effect
My point to Steve is that one gets into an infinite regress if one says that something causes the existence of virtual particles. Rather, virtual particles simply happen because they can happen as described by the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle. They are not caused by anything.
Ok... what I know of the Casmir experiment, is that it requires to plates in a vacuum (not nothing). My question is still how do we determine that nothing is the cause (or how can you even test that).
As to an infinite regress, I agree, that is a problem with an infinite series of cause and effects. I don't see where it is required however; that it either stop at virtual particles or be an infinite regress. How did you come to this conclusion? Which part of the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle do you apply, to get virtual particles poofing into existence from nothing. I need reasons to abandon the principle of causality, which I think it properly basic.
Are you (like Craig with his "bait & switch") saying that the vacuum caused the virtual particles? If so, what was the cause of the vacuum causing the virtual particles? And, what was the cause of the cause of the vacuum causing the virtual particles, etc., etc? The issue is not where the virtual particles come from but what causes them to come into existence?