Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: August 7, 2025, 10:49 pm

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Four proofs of the nonexistence of God
#94
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God
(July 20, 2017 at 2:47 pm)RoadRunner79 Wrote:
(July 20, 2017 at 12:55 pm)Jehanne Wrote: This question is the domain of particle physics.  Virtual particles exist; the Casmir effect was a prediction of them:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casimir_effect

My point to Steve is that one gets into an infinite regress if one says that something causes the existence of virtual particles.  Rather, virtual particles simply happen because they can happen as described by the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle.  They are not caused by anything.

Ok... what I know of the Casmir experiment, is that it requires to plates in a vacuum (not nothing).  My question is still how do we determine that nothing is the cause (or how can you even test that).  

As to an infinite regress, I agree, that is a problem with an infinite series of cause and effects.   I don't see where it is required however; that it either stop at virtual particles or be an infinite regress.  How did you come to this conclusion?  Which part of the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle do you apply, to get virtual particles poofing into existence from nothing.  I need reasons to abandon the principle of causality, which I think it properly basic.

Are you (like Craig with his "bait & switch") saying that the vacuum caused the virtual particles?  If so, what was the cause of the vacuum causing the virtual particles?  And, what was the cause of the cause of the vacuum causing the virtual particles, etc., etc?  The issue is not where the virtual particles come from but what causes them to come into existence?
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Interaktive - July 17, 2017 at 5:51 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Joods - July 17, 2017 at 8:11 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by brewer - July 17, 2017 at 8:12 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by brewer - July 17, 2017 at 10:22 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Joods - July 17, 2017 at 11:36 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by brewer - July 17, 2017 at 12:11 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Joods - July 17, 2017 at 12:18 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Brian37 - July 18, 2017 at 10:39 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by brewer - May 6, 2018 at 11:13 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Joods - July 17, 2017 at 8:19 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 17, 2017 at 12:02 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 17, 2017 at 1:06 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 17, 2017 at 3:02 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 17, 2017 at 5:08 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 17, 2017 at 5:34 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 18, 2017 at 9:37 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 18, 2017 at 12:12 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 18, 2017 at 12:30 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 18, 2017 at 3:54 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 18, 2017 at 9:43 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 18, 2017 at 4:38 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 19, 2017 at 8:21 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 19, 2017 at 12:36 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 19, 2017 at 4:41 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 19, 2017 at 4:46 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 20, 2017 at 12:25 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 18, 2017 at 10:58 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by brewer - July 18, 2017 at 11:01 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 18, 2017 at 9:49 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 18, 2017 at 11:39 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 18, 2017 at 12:11 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by vorlon13 - July 18, 2017 at 12:23 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 19, 2017 at 12:04 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 19, 2017 at 4:56 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 19, 2017 at 5:03 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 20, 2017 at 2:35 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 19, 2017 at 1:18 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 19, 2017 at 2:17 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 19, 2017 at 3:22 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 19, 2017 at 4:11 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 19, 2017 at 4:48 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 19, 2017 at 6:04 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 19, 2017 at 6:23 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 19, 2017 at 6:24 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Silver - July 19, 2017 at 6:27 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 19, 2017 at 6:58 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Silver - July 19, 2017 at 6:59 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 19, 2017 at 9:17 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 19, 2017 at 7:08 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 19, 2017 at 7:30 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Silver - July 19, 2017 at 7:33 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 19, 2017 at 9:40 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 19, 2017 at 10:38 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 20, 2017 at 7:08 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 20, 2017 at 11:24 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 20, 2017 at 3:09 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 20, 2017 at 4:57 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 20, 2017 at 6:14 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 20, 2017 at 7:18 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 21, 2017 at 1:12 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 21, 2017 at 2:23 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 22, 2017 at 7:22 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 24, 2017 at 4:46 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 25, 2017 at 12:31 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Lek - July 20, 2017 at 12:43 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 20, 2017 at 1:45 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 20, 2017 at 2:43 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 20, 2017 at 8:24 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 20, 2017 at 9:10 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 20, 2017 at 10:44 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 20, 2017 at 10:59 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 20, 2017 at 9:33 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 20, 2017 at 12:31 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 20, 2017 at 6:15 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 20, 2017 at 8:52 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 20, 2017 at 10:06 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 22, 2017 at 6:51 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 20, 2017 at 12:55 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 20, 2017 at 2:54 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 20, 2017 at 3:33 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Grandizer - April 26, 2018 at 10:33 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by SteveII - July 19, 2017 at 9:35 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 19, 2017 at 10:32 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 22, 2017 at 9:10 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 23, 2017 at 7:02 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 23, 2017 at 6:38 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Brian37 - July 23, 2017 at 8:59 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Amarok - July 23, 2017 at 6:57 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 24, 2017 at 7:32 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Amarok - July 24, 2017 at 12:29 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 24, 2017 at 6:04 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Amarok - July 24, 2017 at 6:18 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Jehanne - July 25, 2017 at 6:00 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Joods - July 25, 2017 at 1:40 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Amarok - July 25, 2017 at 9:57 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by KevinM1 - July 26, 2017 at 8:47 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by mordant - July 26, 2017 at 9:43 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Minimalist - April 24, 2018 at 11:52 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by G Alan - April 26, 2018 at 8:44 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Joods - April 26, 2018 at 8:47 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by G Alan - April 26, 2018 at 9:21 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by KevinM1 - April 26, 2018 at 10:51 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by G Alan - April 26, 2018 at 11:23 am
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by Grandizer - April 26, 2018 at 10:23 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by G Alan - April 26, 2018 at 2:26 pm
RE: Four proofs of the nonexistence of God - by KevinM1 - April 26, 2018 at 2:49 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Do humans always accept proofs when presented to them? Mystic 59 16476 January 2, 2016 at 6:08 pm
Last Post: Brian37
  Churches losing membership four times faster than they are gaining it Mister Agenda 38 9171 March 27, 2015 at 3:07 pm
Last Post: Mister Agenda
  Four arguments against the existence of God Mudhammam 61 20461 September 24, 2014 at 7:33 pm
Last Post: Simon Moon
  Hundreds of proofs of nothing! MeasH 20 10751 September 12, 2012 at 3:47 pm
Last Post: Ryantology
  The Four Horsemen Napoléon 10 4135 August 26, 2012 at 1:23 pm
Last Post: Napoléon
  The Four Horsemen ... 2 hour discussion. KichigaiNeko 3 2605 January 13, 2012 at 4:46 am
Last Post: ElDinero
  Hundreds of Proofs of God's Existence Paul the Human 27 12838 October 10, 2010 at 2:36 pm
Last Post: Nitsuj
  proofs of existence of God, moslem 44 25440 January 6, 2009 at 8:52 am
Last Post: moslem



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)