(July 23, 2017 at 7:02 am)Jehanne Wrote:(July 23, 2017 at 2:03 am)RoadRunner79 Wrote: I don't know.... perhaps nothing. How can it be expanding, if it is infinite?
It's called "infinities within infinities" (between the numbers 1 and 2, there are an infinite number of numbers), but "nothing" exists, then? This is quite an admission (from a believer, nonetheless), to say that there is a point in reality that physicists can call nothing!
Point is that the so-called "metaphysical absurdities" exist within Nature, and, they exist within Dr. Craig's theological beliefs, either actual infinities or "nothingness". And, so, it's a matter of picking one's poison -- either the Universe contains actual infinities or at some level there is nothing.
I don't believe, that what they are describing in the expansion of the universe, is analogous, to adding infinitesimally small amounts to a real number infinity. Also, in doing this, there is somewhat of a trick. They are changing the units in order to do this. If you stick to one unit of measure (Planck Length for instance), then there is a finite number of them, in any given distance. If you can cut that in half, there is still a finite number. You can keep cutting them in half, but the result is always a finite number, it is only the process which is infinite, and I would add, doesn't seem to match reality.
So how does something, which goes on without end, expand or become bigger (more)? Even if it is my very very small amounts (or increasingly small), you said, that this is a sure as the earth orbiting about it's axis around the sun. I don't think that "infinities within infinities" explains this. You are still talking about expansion or an increase.
I also think that there is a difficulty of equivocation here in what is called the "universe". You can go back in time based on the expansion (this is actually measured a few different ways to my knowledge), and come to the big bang and an age to the universe (13.82 billion years). On the other hand, some refer to the universe as everything even what we speculate on, and cannot observe or make any declarations with much of any certainty. In the first case, the universe does appear to be finite. In the second it is mostly just guesses which are unsupported.
What are the metaphysical absurdities of nothingness, which you mentioned, can you be more specific?
It is said that an argument is what convinces reasonable men and a proof is what it takes to convince even an unreasonable man. - Alexander Vilenkin
If I am shown my error, I will be the first to throw my books into the fire. - Martin Luther
If I am shown my error, I will be the first to throw my books into the fire. - Martin Luther